5 ms·

Seriously. groklaw is starting to sound whiny with their unending criticism of the guy. Argue the system not the verdict. I am for major reforms to the curre

by craigyk 14y ago

Seriously. groklaw is starting to sound whiny with their unending criticism of the guy. Argue the system not the verdict. I am for major reforms to the current patent system, but deep down am secretly pleased that the jury decided to stick it to Samsung for being, lets face it, arrogantly blatant copycats. At the end of the day maybe the verdict was a form of reverse jury nullification. I'm OK with that. The second Apple or anyone else levels that patent system against small players, I'll go run and grab my pitchfork and torch and join groklaw. We'll see if it gets that far. I predict the big boys will blow through a whole pile of time and money before this is all done, and only to further expose the inherent problems in the system.

fpgeek 14y ago
By starting their "thermonuclear war" in the first place, Apple has already, practically speaking, leveled the patent system against small players. Almost by definition, small players don't have bombs to respond with nor do they have sponsors interested in protecting them. How do you think they will respond to bombs flying? Do you really think anyone is going to touch Open webOS in the US after this? Do you think Jolla even dreams of bringing MeeGo here someday? Or will they think "We're not Samsung or Google. We can't survive, let alone make money if any of the big players toss even one bomb in our direction (and they're stockpiling them now). Let's stick to China and India and other markets with saner patent policies."?
- rimantas 14y ago
  Who are those small players in smartphone industry? The second part of your comment is pure speculation. And let's not forget there was/is a hell of lawsuits between mobile makers, so Apple did nothing new what could scare non-existant small guys.
  - fpgeek 14y ago
    Jolla is a real Finnish company started by Nokia employees. The Open webOS platform beta was just released. For that matter here's Lenovo, just starting to expand their smartphone line beyond China, citing the difficulty in "negotiating and securing rights to use other companies’ intellectual property" as one of their secondary reasons for avoiding the US market: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-30/lenovo-brings-smartphone-to-indonesia-philippines-india.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-30/lenovo-brings-smart... And Lenovo is far from the only China-only smartphone player looking to broaden their horizons.
kenster07 14y ago
Please clarify "arrogantly, blatant copycats." And please don't tell us about rounded corners or tapping a touchscreen.
- terhechte 14y ago
  Maybe because they had an internal 132 page document detailing every pixel they want to copy from Apple? http://www.bgr.com/2012/08/08/apple-samsung-patent-lawsuit-internal-report-copy-iphone/ http://www.bgr.com/2012/08/08/apple-samsung-patent-lawsuit-i... And maybe because even Google thought that their tablets were too much like Apple's tablets. http://allthingsd.com/20120725/apple-google-warned-samsung-against-copying-us/ http://allthingsd.com/20120725/apple-google-warned-samsung-a... And maybe because their stores look like Apple Stores, their chargers look like Apple chargers, their Ultrabooks look like Macbook Airs, and some of their phones look like iPhones. Apple never went against Palm, nor Microsoft, nor any other manufacturer, simply because these devices were distinctly different than Apple's products. And yes, I know that the case verdict was only about some specific patents (and no, these didn't include rounded corners), but it's probably clear that the decision of the jury was also influenced by things like the above. You see, even if, technically, the patent system is a mess, and technically the verdict is therefore wrong (which I don't think), Samsung are still copycats. They're not the good guy, just because they use Android. Instead, they're just a capitalist company like Apple.
  - kenster07 14y ago
    Their ultrabooks don't look like MacBook Airs any more than other laptop manufacturers. Same with the cell phones. Most tablets basically look the same and function the same to the end user.
- ToesByNoon 14y ago
  http://www.flickr.com/photos/rockbandit/5731991626/lightbox/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/rockbandit/5731991626/lightbox/ What's your excuse, just a natural progression here too? If you can't tell Samsung copied tons of Apple's stuff, you're just lost in your own world and not worth arguing with. I don't care if you're a fan of Samsung, or a hater of Apple. It doesn't change the fact that Samsung just copies whatever they want. Samsung is McDowell's. " Look... me and the McDonald's people got this little misunderstanding. See, they're McDonald's... I'm McDowell's. They got the Golden Arches, mine is the Golden Arcs. They got the Big Mac, I got the Big Mick. We both got two all-beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles and onions, but their buns have sesame seeds. My buns have no seeds."
kaffiene 14y ago
Apple got where they are by taking other people's ideas and making them more marketable. Railing against Samsung for copying is ironic given that's Apple's modus operandi.

by craigyk 14y ago

fpgeek 14y ago

By starting their "thermonuclear war" in the first place, Apple has already, practically speaking, leveled the patent system against small players. Almost by definition, small players don't have bombs to respond with nor do they have sponsors interested in protecting them. How do you think they will respond to bombs flying? Do you really think anyone is going to touch Open webOS in the US after this? Do you think Jolla even dreams of bringing MeeGo here someday? Or will they think "We're not Samsung or Google. We can't survive, let alone make money if any of the big players toss even one bomb in our direction (and they're stockpiling them now). Let's stick to China and India and other markets with saner patent policies."?

rimantas 14y ago
Who are those small players in smartphone industry? The second part of your comment is pure speculation. And let's not forget there was/is a hell of lawsuits between mobile makers, so Apple did nothing new what could scare non-existant small guys.
- fpgeek 14y ago
  Jolla is a real Finnish company started by Nokia employees. The Open webOS platform beta was just released. For that matter here's Lenovo, just starting to expand their smartphone line beyond China, citing the difficulty in "negotiating and securing rights to use other companies’ intellectual property" as one of their secondary reasons for avoiding the US market: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-30/lenovo-brings-smartphone-to-indonesia-philippines-india.html http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-08-30/lenovo-brings-smart... And Lenovo is far from the only China-only smartphone player looking to broaden their horizons.

kenster07 14y ago

Please clarify "arrogantly, blatant copycats." And please don't tell us about rounded corners or tapping a touchscreen.

terhechte 14y ago
Maybe because they had an internal 132 page document detailing every pixel they want to copy from Apple? http://www.bgr.com/2012/08/08/apple-samsung-patent-lawsuit-internal-report-copy-iphone/ http://www.bgr.com/2012/08/08/apple-samsung-patent-lawsuit-i... And maybe because even Google thought that their tablets were too much like Apple's tablets. http://allthingsd.com/20120725/apple-google-warned-samsung-against-copying-us/ http://allthingsd.com/20120725/apple-google-warned-samsung-a... And maybe because their stores look like Apple Stores, their chargers look like Apple chargers, their Ultrabooks look like Macbook Airs, and some of their phones look like iPhones. Apple never went against Palm, nor Microsoft, nor any other manufacturer, simply because these devices were distinctly different than Apple's products. And yes, I know that the case verdict was only about some specific patents (and no, these didn't include rounded corners), but it's probably clear that the decision of the jury was also influenced by things like the above. You see, even if, technically, the patent system is a mess, and technically the verdict is therefore wrong (which I don't think), Samsung are still copycats. They're not the good guy, just because they use Android. Instead, they're just a capitalist company like Apple.
- kenster07 14y ago
  Their ultrabooks don't look like MacBook Airs any more than other laptop manufacturers. Same with the cell phones. Most tablets basically look the same and function the same to the end user.
ToesByNoon 14y ago
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rockbandit/5731991626/lightbox/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/rockbandit/5731991626/lightbox/ What's your excuse, just a natural progression here too? If you can't tell Samsung copied tons of Apple's stuff, you're just lost in your own world and not worth arguing with. I don't care if you're a fan of Samsung, or a hater of Apple. It doesn't change the fact that Samsung just copies whatever they want. Samsung is McDowell's. " Look... me and the McDonald's people got this little misunderstanding. See, they're McDonald's... I'm McDowell's. They got the Golden Arches, mine is the Golden Arcs. They got the Big Mac, I got the Big Mick. We both got two all-beef patties, special sauce, lettuce, cheese, pickles and onions, but their buns have sesame seeds. My buns have no seeds."

kaffiene 14y ago

Apple got where they are by taking other people's ideas and making them more marketable. Railing against Samsung for copying is ironic given that's Apple's modus operandi.