I think its worth saying that its a gradation, some places are better than others with HN tending to the better. But fundamentally, I don't think large non-toxi

I think its worth saying that its a gradation, some places are better than others with HN tending to the better. But fundamentally, I don't think large non-toxic forums exist. X optimizes for engagement and as studies have shown, that means optimizing for rage bait. Reddit optimizes for rage bait too but includes a voting system that hides unpopular opinions, so any person that conflicts with the majority is marginalized. So on top of being full of rage bait, its an echo-chamber and that is before even talking about the powermod problem. HN is much like reddit in style, so fundamentally HN also tends towards an echo chamber. And by echo chamber, I mean a cringe circle jerk: a New Yorker article called it "performative erudition".