6 ms·

The leadership at Visa, Mastercard, etc. know damned well that consumers and businesses have no other realistic options than them and that a consumer campaign i

The leadership at Visa, Mastercard, etc. know damned well that consumers and businesses have no other realistic options than them and that a consumer campaign is unlikely to sustain itself for more than a few weeks. What we need is pressure on politicians, particularly Democratic legislators and candidates who are desperate for an issue that will garner them support and votes.

eastbound 1y ago
The question I have about most conspiracies including this one is: Why? What’s the motive? You can do everything with a debit card, it probably already happened that Visa was used to facilitate buying a weapon for a school shooting: Were they annoyed? You can buy a dildo with a Mastercard on Amazon: Are they annoyed? But games? Why?
- devmor 1y ago
  Ideology. Some religious, some not. Loud, wealthy people with extremist beliefs are behind most of the actions that restrict our ability to exercise our rights. This one in particular is an attack on art. It’s not just games, but traditional types of art as well that are currently affected by this issue. There is a certain ideology that views non-mainstream art - particularly art that tells a story about uncomfortable subjects - as something “degenerate” to be eradicated.
  - flumpcakes 1y ago
    I would strongly argue that a game that's only purpose is to seek enjoyment from the forceable rape of your family members is no 100% squarely in the 'degenerate' camp. Fictional media or not.
    - devmor 1y ago
      I strongly suggest that you spend a couple minutes reading what that word means and where it comes from before you continue to use it. It may say something about you to others that you would really rather not have them believe about your beliefs.
      - flumpcakes 1y ago
        https://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/degenerate https://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/degenerate > as in corrupt > having or showing lowered moral character or standards > a movie about a gang of degenerate drug dealers > as in pervert > a person who has sunk below the normal moral standard > a degenerate who is uninterested in anything but his own gratification Seems to fit perfectly to describe a video game that is pro sexual assault and rape.
        devmor 1y ago
        Again, where it comes from is an important part of this. You are cherry picking the most extreme example you can think of while using a word specifically implying genetic inferiority. You are using that term when talking about an issue that disproportionately targets marginalized groups and victims of traumatic assault. There is one very specific, well known group in history who would take your side on this issue and use the same terminology. You know who they are.
        flumpcakes 1y ago
        No, I am using the word as defined in the dictionary. Take your pearl clutching eugenics tosh somewhere else. A video game whose purpose is to take enjoyment (and let's be hoenst, sexual gratification) from rape and sexual assault media is morally reprehensible. > You are using that term when talking about an issue that disproportionately targets marginalized groups and victims of traumatic assault. No, I am talking about people who enjoy rape media. If you are saying this is in effect targeting marginalized groups then you are saying these groups enjoy rape media at a higher rate to the wider public. I am sure that's not what you're trying to say, but that's how the argument is sounding from reasonable people who think games that promote rape should be banned. Stop hiding disgusting behaviour behind "marginalized groups". It won't do anything good for them.
        devmor 1y ago
        Your replies are disingenuous and intellectually dishonest. You know that what you're claiming is being targeted is not the only thing being targeted. You know what the word degenerate means, who uses it and why.
- cherioo 1y ago
  It is always about money. Visa was sued for facilitating child porn, and I am guessing they don’t want to wander into another one.
VWWHFSfQ 1y ago
> Democratic legislators and candidates who are desperate for an issue that will garner them support and votes "gamer fury" over not being able to buy porno video games with their credit cards is not exact something that is going to garner the Dems any new support or votes.
- qualeed 1y ago
  If that's how you choose to frame it, you're absolutely right. If, instead, you frame it as "Duopoly of payment processors are deciding which legal content you are allowed to purchase.", surprise, you'll get more support.
  - VWWHFSfQ 1y ago
    Sure, but that's way too abstract and nobody is going to understand that. They'll say, OK, but what's an example of the problem? And then the gamers have to explain that they can't buy pornos on their gaming rig anymore.
    - viraptor 1y ago
      You'd think that people would ask about the details, examples and dig deeper in those situations, right? Yet there's so many people who think gamergate was about journalism ethics.
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    > "Duopoly of payment processors are deciding which legal content you are allowed to purchase.", surprise, you'll get more support From whom? There are better free-speech hills to die on. Unless gamers start organising themselves civically, this issue has too many weaknesses to base on.
    - qualeed 1y ago
      While this specific issue began with games, I'm not sure why the underlying issue is only a problem for gamers. There's comments here talking about other industries and goods that have been affected by similar decisions as well. I'm also sure that people can rally around more than one free speech issue at a time.
spencerflem 1y ago
They don’t seem to be acting very desperate to me
persolb 1y ago
Is AmEx any better? I’m planning to cancel my Mastercard with this gatekeeping as a reference to why. It seems to be the most effective lever most of us have.
- daveoc64 1y ago
  American Express has always had stricter policies about adult content than Visa or MasterCard. They don't allow their cards to be accepted by pornography sites.

eastbound 1y ago

The question I have about most conspiracies including this one is: Why? What’s the motive? You can do everything with a debit card, it probably already happened that Visa was used to facilitate buying a weapon for a school shooting: Were they annoyed? You can buy a dildo with a Mastercard on Amazon: Are they annoyed? But games? Why?

devmor 1y ago
Ideology. Some religious, some not. Loud, wealthy people with extremist beliefs are behind most of the actions that restrict our ability to exercise our rights. This one in particular is an attack on art. It’s not just games, but traditional types of art as well that are currently affected by this issue. There is a certain ideology that views non-mainstream art - particularly art that tells a story about uncomfortable subjects - as something “degenerate” to be eradicated.
- flumpcakes 1y ago
  I would strongly argue that a game that's only purpose is to seek enjoyment from the forceable rape of your family members is no 100% squarely in the 'degenerate' camp. Fictional media or not.
  - devmor 1y ago
    I strongly suggest that you spend a couple minutes reading what that word means and where it comes from before you continue to use it. It may say something about you to others that you would really rather not have them believe about your beliefs.
    - flumpcakes 1y ago
      https://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/degenerate https://www.merriam-webster.com/thesaurus/degenerate > as in corrupt > having or showing lowered moral character or standards > a movie about a gang of degenerate drug dealers > as in pervert > a person who has sunk below the normal moral standard > a degenerate who is uninterested in anything but his own gratification Seems to fit perfectly to describe a video game that is pro sexual assault and rape.
      - devmor 1y ago
        Again, where it comes from is an important part of this. You are cherry picking the most extreme example you can think of while using a word specifically implying genetic inferiority. You are using that term when talking about an issue that disproportionately targets marginalized groups and victims of traumatic assault. There is one very specific, well known group in history who would take your side on this issue and use the same terminology. You know who they are.
        flumpcakes 1y ago
        No, I am using the word as defined in the dictionary. Take your pearl clutching eugenics tosh somewhere else. A video game whose purpose is to take enjoyment (and let's be hoenst, sexual gratification) from rape and sexual assault media is morally reprehensible. > You are using that term when talking about an issue that disproportionately targets marginalized groups and victims of traumatic assault. No, I am talking about people who enjoy rape media. If you are saying this is in effect targeting marginalized groups then you are saying these groups enjoy rape media at a higher rate to the wider public. I am sure that's not what you're trying to say, but that's how the argument is sounding from reasonable people who think games that promote rape should be banned. Stop hiding disgusting behaviour behind "marginalized groups". It won't do anything good for them.
        devmor 1y ago
        Your replies are disingenuous and intellectually dishonest. You know that what you're claiming is being targeted is not the only thing being targeted. You know what the word degenerate means, who uses it and why.
cherioo 1y ago
It is always about money. Visa was sued for facilitating child porn, and I am guessing they don’t want to wander into another one.

VWWHFSfQ 1y ago

> Democratic legislators and candidates who are desperate for an issue that will garner them support and votes "gamer fury" over not being able to buy porno video games with their credit cards is not exact something that is going to garner the Dems any new support or votes.

qualeed 1y ago
If that's how you choose to frame it, you're absolutely right. If, instead, you frame it as "Duopoly of payment processors are deciding which legal content you are allowed to purchase.", surprise, you'll get more support.
- VWWHFSfQ 1y ago
  Sure, but that's way too abstract and nobody is going to understand that. They'll say, OK, but what's an example of the problem? And then the gamers have to explain that they can't buy pornos on their gaming rig anymore.
  - viraptor 1y ago
    You'd think that people would ask about the details, examples and dig deeper in those situations, right? Yet there's so many people who think gamergate was about journalism ethics.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > "Duopoly of payment processors are deciding which legal content you are allowed to purchase.", surprise, you'll get more support From whom? There are better free-speech hills to die on. Unless gamers start organising themselves civically, this issue has too many weaknesses to base on.
  - qualeed 1y ago
    While this specific issue began with games, I'm not sure why the underlying issue is only a problem for gamers. There's comments here talking about other industries and goods that have been affected by similar decisions as well. I'm also sure that people can rally around more than one free speech issue at a time.

spencerflem 1y ago

They don’t seem to be acting very desperate to me

persolb 1y ago

Is AmEx any better? I’m planning to cancel my Mastercard with this gatekeeping as a reference to why. It seems to be the most effective lever most of us have.

daveoc64 1y ago
American Express has always had stricter policies about adult content than Visa or MasterCard. They don't allow their cards to be accepted by pornography sites.