4 ms·

Yea, it's all about a permanent Digital ID and the end of any independent forums. It's the first essential steps before you get to great firewalls and social cr

Yea, it's all about a permanent Digital ID and the end of any independent forums. It's the first essential steps before you get to great firewalls and social credit scores. Remember, Tennessee, Mississippi and Texas already have similar laws in place in the US, so even a nation with better speech and gun laws is still not immune from the slow descent into technocracy.

ls612 1y ago
At least in the US the Supreme Court ruled that these sorts of laws are only kosher because they target porn, which is afforded a lower degree of legal protection (albeit not no protection at all). Trying to restrict access to protected political speech or the like the way the UK and Australia did would likely be a very different court case.
- flumpcakes 1y ago
  What political speech is the UK blocking? If the 'political speech' is not adult in nature, which is true 99.9% of the time, then it can't/won't be blocked under this rule. Unless of course this political speech is happening on a porn site, or a subreddit that has been deemed 18+. Which I can't see a legitimate reason for.
  - nemomarx 1y ago
    It seems like videos of violence are also getting blocked, and I expect eventually stuff about LGBT relationships etc will fall under it. Lots of things are adult that aren't porn.
    - flumpcakes 1y ago
      'videos of violence' is quite wide: children shouldn't be watching videos of people being executed by gangs for example. A lot of LGBT content is aimed at adults. I think we should always be clear when we are making statements like this because it causes great stress, a worked example: People will claim that LGBT is under attack because this law potentially affects some LGBT spaces. These spaces will clearly be meant for 18+ audiences and so fall correctly under the law. Then other people see the first group of people, and from their point of view that group is complaining that their 18+ spaces are blocked from children. "Think of the children" drama ensues. It is similar to Steam taking down incest/rape games and people claiming it was an action against LGBT creators. I don't think that's an argument that should ever be made for obvious reasons. I don't think the government, even if it were under the Conservatives, have banning gay spaces on their current agenda.
      - newtonsmethod 1y ago
        Even if you think a lot of the content captured by the ban should be banned, I don't think age restriction mechanisms should be put on it. Talks around sexuality, the mere mention of certain crimes and unrest are being banned by social media companies, all because of this act. Companies seem to be acting out of caution. I simply don't want to be forced to provide my ID / face to be able to read or access politically important news on social media. Some people would be happier if the bill was limited to only pornography: they likely don't think it has a major effect on UK politics.
    - mulmen 1y ago
      Why would LGBT relationships be considered any more adult than any other type of relationship?
      - nemomarx 1y ago
        I mean I don't think they should, but they get treated that way all the time in the US.
        johnisgood 1y ago
        [flagged]
        mulmen 1y ago
        This is a shockingly ugly and ignorant comment. These are very basic and tiresome arguments that the LGBT community has refuted for centuries. You are the problem. You are very very wrong and it hurts people. Please educate yourself and overcome these flaws in your worldview. > Because they swing their p*nis in front of children during parades and whatnot. I live in Seattle where public nudity is legal. We have nude public beaches. We have a solstice parade with nude cyclists. Nothing about the LGBT community makes them more or less likely to participate in these things that straight people also do because they are things people do. Nudity is not sexual. Wearing a bathing suit is not sexual. Wearing clothes is not sexual. If you find these things sexual it is because you sexualized them in your own mind. > Sounds like a good enough reason to me and it sounds pretty much "adult" to me, unless you think genitalia is not "adult", but then why do we have this porn restriction in the first place if some people could go outside and engage in this type of behavior, in front of anyone, including children? Good enough reason for what? Infringing the rights of citizens who have done nothing wrong? > Maybe they should stop shoving it (their "business") down your throat? It seems to me that the LGBT community has had a lot more forced down their throats in the form of marginalization and outright aggression. Where is the LGBT community forcing anything down your or anyone’s throat? > I do not have a problem with homosexual people. You clearly have a problem with homosexual people. The fact you conflate homosexuality with the LGBT community is even more of a red flag. > I have a problem with them only if they invite me to their bedroom. Inviting you to a bedroom is free speech. You can say no. Simply being lesbian or gay or bi or queer is not an invitation. Personal expression is not an invitation. If you interpret that as an invitation, especially a forced invitation, that is your own ignorance and insecurity showing. > It is none of my business, and please do not try to make it my business by force. That’s right. It’s none of your business. Where or when has the LGBT community forced anything on you? Demanding equal treatment is not forcing you to do anything other than mind your own damn business.
- mywittyname 1y ago
  Given the rulings of the current SCOTUS, I'll go out on a limb and say that it's trivial to go after left-leaning political speech and impossible to go after right-leaning speech. They are already suppressing left-leaning speech by defunding CPB, and ahve openly said their reasons for doing so for are politically motivated. There's a 0% chance this move gets struct down by SCOTUS.
  - d4v3 1y ago
    > They are already suppressing left-leaning speech by defunding CPB, and ahve openly said their reasons for doing so for are politically motivated No longer subsidizing left leaning speech != suppressing left leaning speech
userbinator 1y ago
One possibly significant difference is that the cultural attitudes in the US tend to lean more rebellious and distrustful of the government, and "it's legal if you don't get caught" is a somewhat popular sentiment.
iamacyborg 1y ago
> Remember, Tennessee, Mississippi and Texas already have similar laws in place in the US, so even a nation with better speech and gun laws is still not immune from the slow descent into technocracy. I’m not sure what gun laws have to do with anything but guns are not unreasonably difficult to legally purchase in the UK or EU if you have a specific need for one. It’s a tool and treated as such
ByThyGrace 1y ago
> Remember, Tennessee, Mississippi and Texas already have similar laws in place in the US Interesting, since when? I'm curious about how it's turned out in practise. For web services I mean. An for anyone hosting a message board or comment section.
- dmix 1y ago
  The US states are just targeting the big porn sites like Pornhub to add ID checks AFAIK, I haven't heard of them going after random forums like in the UK. But obviously that sort of power always expands, just like how the UK went from arresting a couple people for offensive tweets back in 2010 to doing 12k arrests/yr in 2025
  - flumpcakes 1y ago
    The UK law was designed to be all encompassing. Why block just the 'porn sites' when you can see porn on forums? The UK law is actually a good implementation if you put child 'safety' as your number one priority, with any other considerations as, in practise, moot. Unfortunately I think free civil discourse between adults, privacy, etc. are just as important as child safety which makes the current law a bit crap. This is similar to the video game and MasterCard/VISA issue - you can buy games that promote sexual violence and incest. Nothing stops children downloading them for free, or using their under-18s debit card from purchasing the non-free versions. In this instance it was private companies leveraging their freedom of association rather than an all encompassing law from a sovereign state, but the intent is the same. As a collective society we do really need to come to grips with what it is that we want. Allowing kids to freely access gang torture/execution videos and playing pro-rape entertainment should probably be tackled. I'm not sure I agree with the implementations though.

ls612 1y ago

At least in the US the Supreme Court ruled that these sorts of laws are only kosher because they target porn, which is afforded a lower degree of legal protection (albeit not no protection at all). Trying to restrict access to protected political speech or the like the way the UK and Australia did would likely be a very different court case.

flumpcakes 1y ago
What political speech is the UK blocking? If the 'political speech' is not adult in nature, which is true 99.9% of the time, then it can't/won't be blocked under this rule. Unless of course this political speech is happening on a porn site, or a subreddit that has been deemed 18+. Which I can't see a legitimate reason for.
- nemomarx 1y ago
  It seems like videos of violence are also getting blocked, and I expect eventually stuff about LGBT relationships etc will fall under it. Lots of things are adult that aren't porn.
  - flumpcakes 1y ago
    'videos of violence' is quite wide: children shouldn't be watching videos of people being executed by gangs for example. A lot of LGBT content is aimed at adults. I think we should always be clear when we are making statements like this because it causes great stress, a worked example: People will claim that LGBT is under attack because this law potentially affects some LGBT spaces. These spaces will clearly be meant for 18+ audiences and so fall correctly under the law. Then other people see the first group of people, and from their point of view that group is complaining that their 18+ spaces are blocked from children. "Think of the children" drama ensues. It is similar to Steam taking down incest/rape games and people claiming it was an action against LGBT creators. I don't think that's an argument that should ever be made for obvious reasons. I don't think the government, even if it were under the Conservatives, have banning gay spaces on their current agenda.
    - newtonsmethod 1y ago
      Even if you think a lot of the content captured by the ban should be banned, I don't think age restriction mechanisms should be put on it. Talks around sexuality, the mere mention of certain crimes and unrest are being banned by social media companies, all because of this act. Companies seem to be acting out of caution. I simply don't want to be forced to provide my ID / face to be able to read or access politically important news on social media. Some people would be happier if the bill was limited to only pornography: they likely don't think it has a major effect on UK politics.
  - mulmen 1y ago
    Why would LGBT relationships be considered any more adult than any other type of relationship?
    - nemomarx 1y ago
      I mean I don't think they should, but they get treated that way all the time in the US.
      - johnisgood 1y ago
        [flagged]
        mulmen 1y ago
        This is a shockingly ugly and ignorant comment. These are very basic and tiresome arguments that the LGBT community has refuted for centuries. You are the problem. You are very very wrong and it hurts people. Please educate yourself and overcome these flaws in your worldview. > Because they swing their p*nis in front of children during parades and whatnot. I live in Seattle where public nudity is legal. We have nude public beaches. We have a solstice parade with nude cyclists. Nothing about the LGBT community makes them more or less likely to participate in these things that straight people also do because they are things people do. Nudity is not sexual. Wearing a bathing suit is not sexual. Wearing clothes is not sexual. If you find these things sexual it is because you sexualized them in your own mind. > Sounds like a good enough reason to me and it sounds pretty much "adult" to me, unless you think genitalia is not "adult", but then why do we have this porn restriction in the first place if some people could go outside and engage in this type of behavior, in front of anyone, including children? Good enough reason for what? Infringing the rights of citizens who have done nothing wrong? > Maybe they should stop shoving it (their "business") down your throat? It seems to me that the LGBT community has had a lot more forced down their throats in the form of marginalization and outright aggression. Where is the LGBT community forcing anything down your or anyone’s throat? > I do not have a problem with homosexual people. You clearly have a problem with homosexual people. The fact you conflate homosexuality with the LGBT community is even more of a red flag. > I have a problem with them only if they invite me to their bedroom. Inviting you to a bedroom is free speech. You can say no. Simply being lesbian or gay or bi or queer is not an invitation. Personal expression is not an invitation. If you interpret that as an invitation, especially a forced invitation, that is your own ignorance and insecurity showing. > It is none of my business, and please do not try to make it my business by force. That’s right. It’s none of your business. Where or when has the LGBT community forced anything on you? Demanding equal treatment is not forcing you to do anything other than mind your own damn business.
mywittyname 1y ago
Given the rulings of the current SCOTUS, I'll go out on a limb and say that it's trivial to go after left-leaning political speech and impossible to go after right-leaning speech. They are already suppressing left-leaning speech by defunding CPB, and ahve openly said their reasons for doing so for are politically motivated. There's a 0% chance this move gets struct down by SCOTUS.
- d4v3 1y ago
  > They are already suppressing left-leaning speech by defunding CPB, and ahve openly said their reasons for doing so for are politically motivated No longer subsidizing left leaning speech != suppressing left leaning speech

userbinator 1y ago

One possibly significant difference is that the cultural attitudes in the US tend to lean more rebellious and distrustful of the government, and "it's legal if you don't get caught" is a somewhat popular sentiment.

iamacyborg 1y ago

> Remember, Tennessee, Mississippi and Texas already have similar laws in place in the US, so even a nation with better speech and gun laws is still not immune from the slow descent into technocracy. I’m not sure what gun laws have to do with anything but guns are not unreasonably difficult to legally purchase in the UK or EU if you have a specific need for one. It’s a tool and treated as such

ByThyGrace 1y ago

> Remember, Tennessee, Mississippi and Texas already have similar laws in place in the US Interesting, since when? I'm curious about how it's turned out in practise. For web services I mean. An for anyone hosting a message board or comment section.

dmix 1y ago
The US states are just targeting the big porn sites like Pornhub to add ID checks AFAIK, I haven't heard of them going after random forums like in the UK. But obviously that sort of power always expands, just like how the UK went from arresting a couple people for offensive tweets back in 2010 to doing 12k arrests/yr in 2025
- flumpcakes 1y ago
  The UK law was designed to be all encompassing. Why block just the 'porn sites' when you can see porn on forums? The UK law is actually a good implementation if you put child 'safety' as your number one priority, with any other considerations as, in practise, moot. Unfortunately I think free civil discourse between adults, privacy, etc. are just as important as child safety which makes the current law a bit crap. This is similar to the video game and MasterCard/VISA issue - you can buy games that promote sexual violence and incest. Nothing stops children downloading them for free, or using their under-18s debit card from purchasing the non-free versions. In this instance it was private companies leveraging their freedom of association rather than an all encompassing law from a sovereign state, but the intent is the same. As a collective society we do really need to come to grips with what it is that we want. Allowing kids to freely access gang torture/execution videos and playing pro-rape entertainment should probably be tackled. I'm not sure I agree with the implementations though.