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That isn't going to stop crime in the US or make dangerous areas in the US really any safer though. Nobody is concerned about someone legally carrying deciding

That isn't going to stop crime in the US or make dangerous areas in the US really any safer though. Nobody is concerned about someone legally carrying deciding to randomly shoot them.

jajko 1y ago
Plenty of mass school (or other) shootings were done by legal firearms, using legally bought ammo. I get what you say, but if folks are smart they should be concerned by any firearm, legal or not. Its trivial in US to obtain one if your record is still clean, you can be a proper psycho weirdo and still get it. The people afraid of doing psychotests to get a gun which can kill tens of people easily in skilled hands... I'd say they are afraid for a good reason. Its like being afraid of driving test to get the license to drive.
Yeul 1y ago
I live in the Netherlands a country with a huge drug cartel problem and still civilians don't carry guns. Criminals shoot eachother and occasionally they shoot law enforcement if they are really dumb. Normal people when there is a shoot out just hide until the incident is over. You'd have to be stupid to get involved. More guns do not equal more safety- especially not because your average wannabe Rambo can't shoot for shit.
- AngryData 1y ago
  And how is that different than the US? Do you think people when they hear gun shots all grab their guns and run outside in the US? The US has a crime problem, but that crime problem is neither caused by guns nor will be solved by gun prohibitions. Even despite the prevalence of legal firearms the US busts illegal gun factories every week, there is no feasible way to disarm the US population except through them wanting to be disarmed and willingly destroying their guns. And until US police stop shooting people with impunity, courts stop imprisoning people for being poor, the government stops deploying armed US troops on US soil and running a gestapo squad, and until crime rates drop to something not resembling countries without functioning governments, I don't see why the US population should want to disarm themselves.
- bugsMarathon88 1y ago
  Some people choose to cower when there is danger, others choose to act in defense. You may choose to call one group of people "normal", just as I could about the other, but it is plain to see how silly that is.
jmogly 1y ago
And more people with guns is what is going to stop crime and make dangerous areas safer?
- AngryData 1y ago
  I never said it would make things safer, but it isn't the cause of our crime problems.
ummonk 1y ago
Okay now you’re being hyperbolic in the other direction. There are plenty of incidents of minor arguments / road rage turning deadly because someone legally carrying decided to draw and use their firearm when there wasn’t any imminent danger. It’s certainly not the norm for gun violence in public but it’s certainly not a nonexistent risk either.
- AngryData 1y ago
  Okay yeah sure, it can and does happen on occasion, but how often matters a lot. We can't just ban everything over every rare and unlikely scenario, and it will still do basically nothing to stop 99.9% of gun crime. Plus from when the CDC was allowed to research such things, they found between 500,000-3,000,000 cases of defensive firearm use per year in the US, 2-10x as high as violent crimes. Maybe you live somewhere privileged enough that you can rely on the police to protect you, but most of the US doesn't. For many people in the US police response is 30+ minutes, and the police themselves pose as much of a threat to them as the criminals they are calling about if a potential danger.

That isn't going to stop crime in the US or make dangerous areas in the US really any safer though. Nobody is concerned about someone legally carrying deciding to randomly shoot them.

jajko 1y ago

Plenty of mass school (or other) shootings were done by legal firearms, using legally bought ammo. I get what you say, but if folks are smart they should be concerned by any firearm, legal or not. Its trivial in US to obtain one if your record is still clean, you can be a proper psycho weirdo and still get it. The people afraid of doing psychotests to get a gun which can kill tens of people easily in skilled hands... I'd say they are afraid for a good reason. Its like being afraid of driving test to get the license to drive.

Yeul 1y ago

I live in the Netherlands a country with a huge drug cartel problem and still civilians don't carry guns. Criminals shoot eachother and occasionally they shoot law enforcement if they are really dumb. Normal people when there is a shoot out just hide until the incident is over. You'd have to be stupid to get involved. More guns do not equal more safety- especially not because your average wannabe Rambo can't shoot for shit.

AngryData 1y ago
And how is that different than the US? Do you think people when they hear gun shots all grab their guns and run outside in the US? The US has a crime problem, but that crime problem is neither caused by guns nor will be solved by gun prohibitions. Even despite the prevalence of legal firearms the US busts illegal gun factories every week, there is no feasible way to disarm the US population except through them wanting to be disarmed and willingly destroying their guns. And until US police stop shooting people with impunity, courts stop imprisoning people for being poor, the government stops deploying armed US troops on US soil and running a gestapo squad, and until crime rates drop to something not resembling countries without functioning governments, I don't see why the US population should want to disarm themselves.
bugsMarathon88 1y ago
Some people choose to cower when there is danger, others choose to act in defense. You may choose to call one group of people "normal", just as I could about the other, but it is plain to see how silly that is.

jmogly 1y ago

And more people with guns is what is going to stop crime and make dangerous areas safer?

AngryData 1y ago
I never said it would make things safer, but it isn't the cause of our crime problems.

ummonk 1y ago

Okay now you’re being hyperbolic in the other direction. There are plenty of incidents of minor arguments / road rage turning deadly because someone legally carrying decided to draw and use their firearm when there wasn’t any imminent danger. It’s certainly not the norm for gun violence in public but it’s certainly not a nonexistent risk either.

AngryData 1y ago
Okay yeah sure, it can and does happen on occasion, but how often matters a lot. We can't just ban everything over every rare and unlikely scenario, and it will still do basically nothing to stop 99.9% of gun crime. Plus from when the CDC was allowed to research such things, they found between 500,000-3,000,000 cases of defensive firearm use per year in the US, 2-10x as high as violent crimes. Maybe you live somewhere privileged enough that you can rely on the police to protect you, but most of the US doesn't. For many people in the US police response is 30+ minutes, and the police themselves pose as much of a threat to them as the criminals they are calling about if a potential danger.