2 ms·

it is kind of befuddling that they had a working system that gave people the marginal quantity to not rebel and even that was too much for them. Even then don't

it is kind of befuddling that they had a working system that gave people the marginal quantity to not rebel and even that was too much for them. Even then don't carry water for NK as some sort of utopia. America is (as clickbaity as I feel saying this) more communist at its worst than NK ever was.

tehjoker 1y ago
We are capitalist. The fact that you doubt this means you are misinformed on basic facts.
- astrange 1y ago
  America's homeless population is because of America's land use policy, which is pretty communist. Or rather, it runs on "economic democracy" - no matter how much money you have, you can't do what you want with your land unless all your neighbors agree with it enough to change the local zoning policy. Which means you can't build low-cost multi-family housing on it.
  - throwaway7783 1y ago
    That's democracy and not communism?
    - GauntletWizard 1y ago
      It doesn't work, so it must not be communism.
    - rangestransform 1y ago
      A charitable interpretation is that it is a form of democratic control of wealth (neighbours decide what you do with your land) rather than individual control of wealth (building however many stories you want on your own land), and democratic control of wealth is definitely closer to communism than individual control of wealth
      - throwaway7783 1y ago
        Yes, I agree. extending that logic, democracy in general is closer to communism, than to oligarchy (extremes on either side, ignoring feudalism ), but its not communism. I simplify the "isms" with communism - socialism - democracy -capitalism - oligarchy , extremes at both ends generally not good to society at large.
  - tehjoker 1y ago
    ??? What country would let rich people do whatever they want with national territory? In any case, you are complaining about other landed people. The renter class and homeless are considered non-persons.
- scarface_74 1y ago
  You’re right it’s not like we have a leader that unilaterally decides what companies live or die or what mergers get approved based on who pays him off. Or the same leader doesn’t unilaterally raise tarrffs, exempt companies that bow to him and tell other companies not to pass cost increases on to customers. That doesn’t seem like the free market to me.
  - tehjoker 1y ago
    Capitalism != free market. It means private ownership of the means of production. Capitalism naturally tends towards monopoly due to competition. Companies go out of business, competitors buy up their remains, and consolidate market share. What is happening politically is a reflection of this concentration of power that naturally accumulated due to the dynamics of capitalism (and as they rose they influence the state to enable further concentration, also part of the natural life of actually existing capitalism). In new markets, capitalism looks pretty good and the competition drives good deals for consumers and the barriers to entry are low. This devolves over time into a highly concentrated market with high barriers to entry. We've seen this story in our industry time and time again. Unfortunately, the new market state is transient, and the concentrated part is steady state. This is why people are always looking for new market opportunities.
    - scarface_74 1y ago
      None of these companies that Trump is pressuring not to raise prices in response to tariffs are in any shape form or fashion monopolies, duopoly’s are any other type of “opily”. They are the car manufacturers and grocery stores and retail stores which have not been a monopoly in our lifetime. And by “our” industry I assume you mean tech. Which one of the tech companies is a “monopoly”? There is nothing I can use Google for that I can’t use another company for and with Google Search, it isn’t even the best. Amazon? I can order most things from other places or go into a physical store. Apple? I can buy one of hundreds of different phones or computers Microsoft? My life is completely Microsoft free.
JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> America is (as clickbaity as I feel saying this) more communist at its worst than NK ever was America has its wealth more evenly divided than North Korea does. America has never been communist. (And North Korea doesn't organise its economy according to Marxist-Lenninist principles other than running a command economy.)

tehjoker 1y ago

We are capitalist. The fact that you doubt this means you are misinformed on basic facts.

astrange 1y ago
America's homeless population is because of America's land use policy, which is pretty communist. Or rather, it runs on "economic democracy" - no matter how much money you have, you can't do what you want with your land unless all your neighbors agree with it enough to change the local zoning policy. Which means you can't build low-cost multi-family housing on it.
- throwaway7783 1y ago
  That's democracy and not communism?
  - GauntletWizard 1y ago
    It doesn't work, so it must not be communism.
  - rangestransform 1y ago
    A charitable interpretation is that it is a form of democratic control of wealth (neighbours decide what you do with your land) rather than individual control of wealth (building however many stories you want on your own land), and democratic control of wealth is definitely closer to communism than individual control of wealth
    - throwaway7783 1y ago
      Yes, I agree. extending that logic, democracy in general is closer to communism, than to oligarchy (extremes on either side, ignoring feudalism ), but its not communism. I simplify the "isms" with communism - socialism - democracy -capitalism - oligarchy , extremes at both ends generally not good to society at large.
- tehjoker 1y ago
  ??? What country would let rich people do whatever they want with national territory? In any case, you are complaining about other landed people. The renter class and homeless are considered non-persons.
scarface_74 1y ago
You’re right it’s not like we have a leader that unilaterally decides what companies live or die or what mergers get approved based on who pays him off. Or the same leader doesn’t unilaterally raise tarrffs, exempt companies that bow to him and tell other companies not to pass cost increases on to customers. That doesn’t seem like the free market to me.
- tehjoker 1y ago
  Capitalism != free market. It means private ownership of the means of production. Capitalism naturally tends towards monopoly due to competition. Companies go out of business, competitors buy up their remains, and consolidate market share. What is happening politically is a reflection of this concentration of power that naturally accumulated due to the dynamics of capitalism (and as they rose they influence the state to enable further concentration, also part of the natural life of actually existing capitalism). In new markets, capitalism looks pretty good and the competition drives good deals for consumers and the barriers to entry are low. This devolves over time into a highly concentrated market with high barriers to entry. We've seen this story in our industry time and time again. Unfortunately, the new market state is transient, and the concentrated part is steady state. This is why people are always looking for new market opportunities.
  - scarface_74 1y ago
    None of these companies that Trump is pressuring not to raise prices in response to tariffs are in any shape form or fashion monopolies, duopoly’s are any other type of “opily”. They are the car manufacturers and grocery stores and retail stores which have not been a monopoly in our lifetime. And by “our” industry I assume you mean tech. Which one of the tech companies is a “monopoly”? There is nothing I can use Google for that I can’t use another company for and with Google Search, it isn’t even the best. Amazon? I can order most things from other places or go into a physical store. Apple? I can buy one of hundreds of different phones or computers Microsoft? My life is completely Microsoft free.

JumpCrisscross 1y ago

> America is (as clickbaity as I feel saying this) more communist at its worst than NK ever was America has its wealth more evenly divided than North Korea does. America has never been communist. (And North Korea doesn't organise its economy according to Marxist-Lenninist principles other than running a command economy.)