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What is interesting is if the world is not that reliant on Taiwan chips anymore would China really care that much about Taiwan?

by Gee101 1y ago

Zaiberia 1y ago
Yes, they would. However, if Taiwan wasn’t as important to the world because of their chips then the world would probably not care as much about what communist China wants to do to them.
kortilla 1y ago
Probably, my understanding is that the primary reason China cares about Taiwan is internal pressure about the separatism. The power Taiwan has is the only reason they haven’t acted.
2muchcoffeeman 1y ago
China is not interested in Taiwan for the chips. They want it back since they believe Taiwan is part of China.
- owebmaster 1y ago
  Taiwan also believes they are (part of) China
  - curseofcasandra 1y ago
    Or more accurately, the Taiwanese government also believes that mainland China and Taiwan should be unified (ie. a One-China Interpretation). But that this One-China should be under the rule of the Taiwanese government and not the CCP, which they considered an illegitimate government, up until the 1992 Consensus. After the 1992 Consensus [1], the Taiwanese government still considered the Mainland its territory (again under a One-China Interpretation), but also acknowledges the CCP's interpretation of One-China. In practice, this meant they officially abandoned plans to re-take the Mainland, and focus on maintaining the status quo of peace and stability. Interestingly, the Taiwanese government also used to lay claim to Mongolia in addition to the Chinese Mainland.[2] [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Consensus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Consensus [2]https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/feat/archives/2024/08/25/2003822726 https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/feat/archives/2024/08/25/20...
    - sarchertech 1y ago
      Almost no one in Taiwan still believes that though. But China has made it clear that they will invade if the Taiwanese government changes their official stance to be that they’re an independent country.
    - ergocoder 1y ago
      The unification isn't the issue. It's whose government will get to run the whole thing.
    - jdietrich 1y ago
      The UN has only ever recognised one China - they just switched from recognising the ROC to the PRC in 1971. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembly_Resolution_2758_(XXVI) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembl...
  - mensetmanusman 1y ago
    Not the young.
  - kelnos 1y ago
    It's more complicated than that, and I think many people in Taiwan (even some in government), especially younger folks, wouldn't really think that way anymore. While it's dicey to say so, many would support full independence.
usefulcat 1y ago
Wasn't China already pissed about Taiwan long before Taiwan was doing a lot of semiconductor manufacturing?
johanyc 1y ago
They would. The main reason has always been the location. It’s right at the doorstep of China. It’s the same reason when Russia tried to install missile in Cuba, Americans dont like that. Cuba “crisis” is actually a US centric term. Also on east coast of Taiwan, theres a deep waters, submarines can enter pacific ocean much more stealthily. Everything else is just bonus to them. Semiconductors, supporting nationalism, you name it.
- IncreasePosts 1y ago
  South Korea and Japan/Okinawa seem either just as good or better if the US wants to have bases near China. And the US already has 80k troops there
  - laborcontract 1y ago
    You have to take a look at a map to really understand Taiwan's importance. Taiwan isn't about military proximity. It's about access shipping access. Try open up a map. Despite China having a vast coastline, they do not have access to the open seas. Every one of their shipping lanes requires passage through another nation's waters. If a heavy conflict were to erupt, China's supply chains would be cut off via naval blockade. It's a huge risk to China, and one they've attempted to ameliorate via the Belt and Road Initiative. That changes if they acquire Taiwan. Taiwan's importance is not of offensive, but defensive primacy.
    - 15155 1y ago
      > If a heavy conflict were to erupt, China's supply chains would be cut off via naval blockade Or possibly the 30+ fast attack submarines sinking every military or resupply vessel in the region, augmented by a colossal amount of rapidly-deployed naval mines. Taiwan doesn't buy them much in this regard. Why would China be permitted to use sea freight at all in a "heavy conflict" scenario? Why not just sink these vessels near their origin - why allow Brazilian soybeans to even make it out of the hemisphere?
    - anon7725 1y ago
kelnos 1y ago
China has wanted Taiwan long before they fabbed semiconductors. It's a matter of ego and nationalism, not economics. It's also political: China hates that there's a Western-style democracy full of "Chinese rebels" on an island 80 miles from their doorstep. They also don't like the cozy relationship between the Taiwanese and US militaries.

What is interesting is if the world is not that reliant on Taiwan chips anymore would China really care that much about Taiwan?

by Gee101 1y ago

What is interesting is if the world is not that reliant on Taiwan chips anymore would China really care that much about Taiwan?

Zaiberia 1y ago

Yes, they would. However, if Taiwan wasn’t as important to the world because of their chips then the world would probably not care as much about what communist China wants to do to them.

kortilla 1y ago

Probably, my understanding is that the primary reason China cares about Taiwan is internal pressure about the separatism. The power Taiwan has is the only reason they haven’t acted.

2muchcoffeeman 1y ago

China is not interested in Taiwan for the chips. They want it back since they believe Taiwan is part of China.

owebmaster 1y ago
Taiwan also believes they are (part of) China
- curseofcasandra 1y ago
  Or more accurately, the Taiwanese government also believes that mainland China and Taiwan should be unified (ie. a One-China Interpretation). But that this One-China should be under the rule of the Taiwanese government and not the CCP, which they considered an illegitimate government, up until the 1992 Consensus. After the 1992 Consensus [1], the Taiwanese government still considered the Mainland its territory (again under a One-China Interpretation), but also acknowledges the CCP's interpretation of One-China. In practice, this meant they officially abandoned plans to re-take the Mainland, and focus on maintaining the status quo of peace and stability. Interestingly, the Taiwanese government also used to lay claim to Mongolia in addition to the Chinese Mainland.[2] [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Consensus https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Consensus [2]https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/feat/archives/2024/08/25/2003822726 https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/feat/archives/2024/08/25/20...
  - sarchertech 1y ago
    Almost no one in Taiwan still believes that though. But China has made it clear that they will invade if the Taiwanese government changes their official stance to be that they’re an independent country.
  - ergocoder 1y ago
    The unification isn't the issue. It's whose government will get to run the whole thing.
  - jdietrich 1y ago
    The UN has only ever recognised one China - they just switched from recognising the ROC to the PRC in 1971. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembly_Resolution_2758_(XXVI) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nations_General_Assembl...
- mensetmanusman 1y ago
  Not the young.
- kelnos 1y ago
  It's more complicated than that, and I think many people in Taiwan (even some in government), especially younger folks, wouldn't really think that way anymore. While it's dicey to say so, many would support full independence.

usefulcat 1y ago

Wasn't China already pissed about Taiwan long before Taiwan was doing a lot of semiconductor manufacturing?

johanyc 1y ago

They would. The main reason has always been the location. It’s right at the doorstep of China. It’s the same reason when Russia tried to install missile in Cuba, Americans dont like that. Cuba “crisis” is actually a US centric term. Also on east coast of Taiwan, theres a deep waters, submarines can enter pacific ocean much more stealthily. Everything else is just bonus to them. Semiconductors, supporting nationalism, you name it.

IncreasePosts 1y ago
South Korea and Japan/Okinawa seem either just as good or better if the US wants to have bases near China. And the US already has 80k troops there
- laborcontract 1y ago
  You have to take a look at a map to really understand Taiwan's importance. Taiwan isn't about military proximity. It's about access shipping access. Try open up a map. Despite China having a vast coastline, they do not have access to the open seas. Every one of their shipping lanes requires passage through another nation's waters. If a heavy conflict were to erupt, China's supply chains would be cut off via naval blockade. It's a huge risk to China, and one they've attempted to ameliorate via the Belt and Road Initiative. That changes if they acquire Taiwan. Taiwan's importance is not of offensive, but defensive primacy.
  - 15155 1y ago
    > If a heavy conflict were to erupt, China's supply chains would be cut off via naval blockade Or possibly the 30+ fast attack submarines sinking every military or resupply vessel in the region, augmented by a colossal amount of rapidly-deployed naval mines. Taiwan doesn't buy them much in this regard. Why would China be permitted to use sea freight at all in a "heavy conflict" scenario? Why not just sink these vessels near their origin - why allow Brazilian soybeans to even make it out of the hemisphere?
  - anon7725 1y ago

kelnos 1y ago

China has wanted Taiwan long before they fabbed semiconductors. It's a matter of ego and nationalism, not economics. It's also political: China hates that there's a Western-style democracy full of "Chinese rebels" on an island 80 miles from their doorstep. They also don't like the cozy relationship between the Taiwanese and US militaries.