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> Starfish Prime caused an electromagnetic pulse (EMP) that was far larger than expected, so much larger that it drove much of the instrumentation off scale, ca

by baq 1y ago

> Starfish Prime caused an electromagnetic pulse (EMP) that was far larger than expected, so much larger that it drove much of the instrumentation off scale, causing great difficulty in getting accurate measurements. The Starfish Prime electromagnetic pulse also made those effects known to the public by causing electrical damage in Hawaii, about 900 miles (1,450 km) away from the detonation point, knocking out about 300 streetlights, setting off numerous burglar alarms, and damaging a telephone company microwave link. The EMP damage to the microwave link shut down telephone calls from Kauai to the other Hawaiian Islands. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starfish_Prime https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starfish_Prime

xoa 1y ago
Yes, very good you're capable of a simplistic wikipedia search. Now I'd like you to try thinking about the paragraph you just linked for a moment: is "Hawaii", the "300 streetlights", "numerous burglar alarms", and a "microwave link" in the atmosphere (and on the ground, or indeed literally the ground) or in Earth orbit? If you read further, you'll find that the mechanism of generation involves the interaction of the gamma ray emissions with the atmosphere and Earth's magnetic field, that at 500km+ the effect are is reduced, and then find that in your example of Starfish Prime the primary damage to the satellites it affected was not due to EMP at all but rather because the test created radiation belts that damaged solar panels as satellites passed through. This would reduce design lifetime but isn't an immediate killer of everything. You'd need far more then a couple of nukes. Of course, purposefully detonating nuclear weapons to create large scale NEMP effects might well still disrupt Starlink to the degree that it'd effect any piece of ground electronics, because the ground effects would be far, far worse. The satellite constellation could be ok enough to still be functional at reduced capacity, but if terminals and ground stations get toasted that's not immediately helpful. But that directly leads, again, to the fact that you're talking about LAUNCHING A NUCLEAR WAR ON THE ENTIRE WORLD here. No internet is going to be doing very well! So yes: Starlink is pretty darn robust.
- baq 1y ago
  > Starlink is pretty darn robust. not saying it isn't. I was the evangelist of it in 2022 and seen the pentagon salivating at what they've seen and rightly so. what it isn't is indestructible, though - and we don't know the capability of nukes designed specifcally to cause the Kessler syndrome in LEO for a few years. if I was China I'd have a project for this commissioned by Jan 2023.
  - ben_w 1y ago
    > we don't know the capability of nukes designed specifcally to cause the Kessler syndrome in LEO for a few years I wouldn't even consider a nuke for that. Energetic plasma ball resulting from nuke is not effective method to do so and any debris that survives the explosion isn't going to still be in LEO, but also no plausible deniability because it's obviously a nuke. Try "we launched a satelite and it RUDed (honest we pinky swear it wasn't just a loose heap of ball bearings like it appears on radar) and now LEO is marginally more dangerous".

by baq 1y ago

xoa 1y ago

Yes, very good you're capable of a simplistic wikipedia search. Now I'd like you to try thinking about the paragraph you just linked for a moment: is "Hawaii", the "300 streetlights", "numerous burglar alarms", and a "microwave link" in the atmosphere (and on the ground, or indeed literally the ground) or in Earth orbit? If you read further, you'll find that the mechanism of generation involves the interaction of the gamma ray emissions with the atmosphere and Earth's magnetic field, that at 500km+ the effect are is reduced, and then find that in your example of Starfish Prime the primary damage to the satellites it affected was not due to EMP at all but rather because the test created radiation belts that damaged solar panels as satellites passed through. This would reduce design lifetime but isn't an immediate killer of everything. You'd need far more then a couple of nukes. Of course, purposefully detonating nuclear weapons to create large scale NEMP effects might well still disrupt Starlink to the degree that it'd effect any piece of ground electronics, because the ground effects would be far, far worse. The satellite constellation could be ok enough to still be functional at reduced capacity, but if terminals and ground stations get toasted that's not immediately helpful. But that directly leads, again, to the fact that you're talking about LAUNCHING A NUCLEAR WAR ON THE ENTIRE WORLD here. No internet is going to be doing very well! So yes: Starlink is pretty darn robust.

baq 1y ago
> Starlink is pretty darn robust. not saying it isn't. I was the evangelist of it in 2022 and seen the pentagon salivating at what they've seen and rightly so. what it isn't is indestructible, though - and we don't know the capability of nukes designed specifcally to cause the Kessler syndrome in LEO for a few years. if I was China I'd have a project for this commissioned by Jan 2023.
- ben_w 1y ago
  > we don't know the capability of nukes designed specifcally to cause the Kessler syndrome in LEO for a few years I wouldn't even consider a nuke for that. Energetic plasma ball resulting from nuke is not effective method to do so and any debris that survives the explosion isn't going to still be in LEO, but also no plausible deniability because it's obviously a nuke. Try "we launched a satelite and it RUDed (honest we pinky swear it wasn't just a loose heap of ball bearings like it appears on radar) and now LEO is marginally more dangerous".