3 ms·

It's crazy how the P320 has such a bad reputation, while the P365, a 9mm micro-pistol by Sig Sauer, is a phenomenal piece of kit by comparison. I purchased mine

It's crazy how the P320 has such a bad reputation, while the P365, a 9mm micro-pistol by Sig Sauer, is a phenomenal piece of kit by comparison. I purchased mine in 2018 and it's seen thousands of rounds put through it with zero issues encountered.

hollywood_court 1y ago
Agreed. It seems that Sig really dropped the ball with the P320. My top 3 most used hand guns are the CZ P-10 F, the Sig P365, and the Sig P322. I honestly never thought I'd ever buy a modern handgun unless it was made by Sig. Until I tried the CZ. The P-10 F is my favorite full sized striker fired pistol. And that's coming from a guy that owns 30+ Sig pistols.
- unethical_ban 1y ago
  Yeah, just from a reputational standpoint I'm not sure I ever want to buy a Sig unless it's used. Too many other good brands to financially support. I've been eyeing a Canik or Walther, I want a premium trigger. The CZs are reliable weapons, but their trigger feels "gritty" to me. My Sig SP2022 is my favorite trigger of the guns I own.
  - 83 1y ago
    Fwiw, I love my PPQ Q5 Match.
  - hollywood_court 1y ago
    I had the opposite experience with the P-10 F. Granted it's the only CZ pistol I own. But it's also the only modern pistol I own that was ready to go right out of the box without any kind of needed improvements or modifications.
giantg2 1y ago
Why would it be crazy when they're completely separate systems?
- kstrauser 1y ago
  All I know about this situation is what I've read in these comments just now. I don't have a dog in this hunt. But I think the surprise is that a company who makes something considered highly reliable would make a similar item that the Air Force claims is killing their airmen. It'd be like Toyota making another pickup, the Bellevue, that likes to randomly explode. Sure, things happen, but Toyota? Huh, that would be unexpected.
  - int_19h 1y ago
    With SIG USA specifically there's a long track record of making firearms that can only be described as problematic. For example, their attempt to adapt SG 55x to the American market - all versions had some issues, but especially so the ones chambered in 7.62x39. The unusual thing here is that this is a problem in a product that managed to pass US DoD acceptance testing. But the drop safety issue was already known at the time, so one has to wonder just how much in soft bribes SIG had to spend to get it adopted regardless.
  - giantg2 1y ago
    Ford made the Pinto. The Volt or Bolt from GM had battery fires. I believe Tesla has had multiple safety and quality issues come up.
    - kgermino 1y ago
      May be my age, but I wouldn't say any of those brands are a mark of quality. Rather the opposite in fact. They are all interesting in their own way (especially Tesla), but certainly not quality/reliability-first organizations.
      - andrewmcwatters 1y ago
        Ford, GM, and Tesla are all bottom barrel automakers. All three of them relying on the government to prop them up, too. Otherwise, the Japanese market would have obliterated the American automotive industry ages ago.
paradox460 1y ago
I got my wife the 365SAS, and liked it enough to get one for myself. It's so good for CC, and holds reasonable accuracy out to 15 yrds
djoldman 1y ago
As someone who has never touched a firearm, I'm curious: what are you doing firing thousands of rounds? Is it target practice?
- koolba 1y ago
  A thousand rounds is not that much. A standard box has 50 rounds, if you fire four boxes in a weekend, you can easily go through a thousand rounds over a month. Now at $.25-.$30 / round, this does add up to an expensive hobby.
  - OrvalWintermute 1y ago
    It really depends on the weapon / type. I’d estimate I have shot over 100K rounds of 7.62 thanks to a good amount of time as an M60/M240 Gunner
- dankwizard 1y ago
  i liberate a LOT of places
- twalla 1y ago
  Like anything you want to become proficient at, you need consistent practice. How many free throws do you think LeBron has practiced? Now imagine you die if you miss. Also it’s fun to blast stuff.
- 9x39 1y ago
  Practicing until it’s muscle memory. Progressing through increased distances, smaller targets, more challenging conditions. Particularly in long-range shooting, dialing in hand loaded round configurations for accuracy and consistency. I think it’s possible for many shooters to achieve parts of a flow state when doing this. Imagine the satisfaction of throwing, catching, or hitting balls over and over in muscle memory, letting your mind and body work together to let your coordination and accuracy improve to solve the puzzle.
- gottorf 1y ago
  As a recreational shooter, thousands of rounds is really not that much. I virtually never leave a range trip with fewer than a hundred rounds fired. And yes, for me, it's a combination of practice and fun ("plinking"). If ammunition didn't cost what it did, I'm sure I would shoot a lot more.
rdl 1y ago
I am mostly a P365 carrier/shooter now, but for a couple years a P320 Compact was my primary handgun (with an X5 P226 SAO for competition); I put probably 15-20k rounds through the P320 (1k round classes, etc, back when ammo was $150-180/case) (and never got the drop-safe mod done), and no problems. So it's some combination of QC, specific units, and bad luck -- but even a 0.001% risk of something happening is a big deal. The quick P250 -> P320 without really designing it properly does seem to have been a mistake, though.

hollywood_court 1y ago

Agreed. It seems that Sig really dropped the ball with the P320. My top 3 most used hand guns are the CZ P-10 F, the Sig P365, and the Sig P322. I honestly never thought I'd ever buy a modern handgun unless it was made by Sig. Until I tried the CZ. The P-10 F is my favorite full sized striker fired pistol. And that's coming from a guy that owns 30+ Sig pistols.

unethical_ban 1y ago
Yeah, just from a reputational standpoint I'm not sure I ever want to buy a Sig unless it's used. Too many other good brands to financially support. I've been eyeing a Canik or Walther, I want a premium trigger. The CZs are reliable weapons, but their trigger feels "gritty" to me. My Sig SP2022 is my favorite trigger of the guns I own.
- 83 1y ago
  Fwiw, I love my PPQ Q5 Match.
- hollywood_court 1y ago
  I had the opposite experience with the P-10 F. Granted it's the only CZ pistol I own. But it's also the only modern pistol I own that was ready to go right out of the box without any kind of needed improvements or modifications.

giantg2 1y ago

Why would it be crazy when they're completely separate systems?

kstrauser 1y ago
All I know about this situation is what I've read in these comments just now. I don't have a dog in this hunt. But I think the surprise is that a company who makes something considered highly reliable would make a similar item that the Air Force claims is killing their airmen. It'd be like Toyota making another pickup, the Bellevue, that likes to randomly explode. Sure, things happen, but Toyota? Huh, that would be unexpected.
- int_19h 1y ago
  With SIG USA specifically there's a long track record of making firearms that can only be described as problematic. For example, their attempt to adapt SG 55x to the American market - all versions had some issues, but especially so the ones chambered in 7.62x39. The unusual thing here is that this is a problem in a product that managed to pass US DoD acceptance testing. But the drop safety issue was already known at the time, so one has to wonder just how much in soft bribes SIG had to spend to get it adopted regardless.
- giantg2 1y ago
  Ford made the Pinto. The Volt or Bolt from GM had battery fires. I believe Tesla has had multiple safety and quality issues come up.
  - kgermino 1y ago
    May be my age, but I wouldn't say any of those brands are a mark of quality. Rather the opposite in fact. They are all interesting in their own way (especially Tesla), but certainly not quality/reliability-first organizations.
    - andrewmcwatters 1y ago
      Ford, GM, and Tesla are all bottom barrel automakers. All three of them relying on the government to prop them up, too. Otherwise, the Japanese market would have obliterated the American automotive industry ages ago.

paradox460 1y ago

I got my wife the 365SAS, and liked it enough to get one for myself. It's so good for CC, and holds reasonable accuracy out to 15 yrds

djoldman 1y ago

As someone who has never touched a firearm, I'm curious: what are you doing firing thousands of rounds? Is it target practice?

koolba 1y ago
A thousand rounds is not that much. A standard box has 50 rounds, if you fire four boxes in a weekend, you can easily go through a thousand rounds over a month. Now at $.25-.$30 / round, this does add up to an expensive hobby.
- OrvalWintermute 1y ago
  It really depends on the weapon / type. I’d estimate I have shot over 100K rounds of 7.62 thanks to a good amount of time as an M60/M240 Gunner
dankwizard 1y ago
i liberate a LOT of places
twalla 1y ago
Like anything you want to become proficient at, you need consistent practice. How many free throws do you think LeBron has practiced? Now imagine you die if you miss. Also it’s fun to blast stuff.
9x39 1y ago
Practicing until it’s muscle memory. Progressing through increased distances, smaller targets, more challenging conditions. Particularly in long-range shooting, dialing in hand loaded round configurations for accuracy and consistency. I think it’s possible for many shooters to achieve parts of a flow state when doing this. Imagine the satisfaction of throwing, catching, or hitting balls over and over in muscle memory, letting your mind and body work together to let your coordination and accuracy improve to solve the puzzle.
gottorf 1y ago
As a recreational shooter, thousands of rounds is really not that much. I virtually never leave a range trip with fewer than a hundred rounds fired. And yes, for me, it's a combination of practice and fun ("plinking"). If ammunition didn't cost what it did, I'm sure I would shoot a lot more.

rdl 1y ago

I am mostly a P365 carrier/shooter now, but for a couple years a P320 Compact was my primary handgun (with an X5 P226 SAO for competition); I put probably 15-20k rounds through the P320 (1k round classes, etc, back when ammo was $150-180/case) (and never got the drop-safe mod done), and no problems. So it's some combination of QC, specific units, and bad luck -- but even a 0.001% risk of something happening is a big deal. The quick P250 -> P320 without really designing it properly does seem to have been a mistake, though.