3 ms·

Do you truly believe the US involvement in UNESCO was cruft? This is entirely because of Palestine.

CGMthrowaway 1y ago
Isn't that a false dichotomy?
lupusreal 1y ago
More accurately, it's because of Israel and the Israeli lobby in America. It isn't Palestine that's inducing America to leave UNESCO, it's Israel and Israel's supporters who are doing it, to protest UNESCO's recognition of Palestine.
- DSingularity 1y ago
  The Israeli lobby is a proxy for American weapon manufacturers that found being in bed with savage Zionists good for business.
  - lupusreal 1y ago
    That's part of it, but a relatively small part of it. Most of it is Christians who think they can force apocalyptic prophecies to come true by ensuring Israel's continued existence. The nature of their belief is such that it doesn't matter how badly Israel behaves, they will unconditionally support them.
    - DSingularity 1y ago
      I think hundreds of billions in dollars and unique testing bench for weapons development is a significant part. The fact that it has synergies with the American foreign policy for dominating the oil rich Middle East is also definitely another plus. It’s not just “oh the Israel lobby is strong”.
      - lupusreal 1y ago
        The Israelis don't buy that many weapons from America, either directly nor by having the American government buy and gift the weapons. It's significant, but weapon sales alone can't explain the fanaticism of American politicians in both parties and the American public. Weapon sales can't explain why states like Texas would pass laws requiring school teachers to swear oaths of loyalty to Israel. It can't explain why small town diners in rural America hang Israeli flags, or why America/Israel combined flag fridge magnets and patches are on sale at every truckstop. The American public are absolutely fanatical about Israel and it's mostly because of their insane religious beliefs, not because they're all invested in the defense industry. Look up figures for how much defense material Israel actually imports from America vs other countries. Have you ever heard of American politicians getting grilled at debates about how much they support Japan? Have you ever heard American politicians boasting that they support Qatar far more than their opponent? How many American politicians mention support for Australia during their campaign rallies? Support for Israel is a unique phenomenon in American politics, not merely a straight forward function of arms exports. It's because the American people have loyalty to Israel specifically, because their bibles say that Israel is important and say nothing about South Korea.
        DSingularity 1y ago
        I would have guessed that significant quantities of weapons were purchased given the fact that the main workhorse of the Israeli Air Force is probably the American f15 and most of its munitions are American made. Not to mention the f35 and so on.
orblivion 1y ago
I'm responding to the general point that the administration just wants to destroy and not build. I'm saying that there's actually a good argument for that. Whether that's what's actually happening is ... now questionable. I don't know anything about UNESCO, but Palestine is a plausible answer to this administration's actual motivations here. But then that would be different from the simple "just wants to destroy" angle.

Isn't that a false dichotomy?

More accurately, it's because of Israel and the Israeli lobby in America. It isn't Palestine that's inducing America to leave UNESCO, it's Israel and Israel's supporters who are doing it, to protest UNESCO's recognition of Palestine.

DSingularity 1y ago
The Israeli lobby is a proxy for American weapon manufacturers that found being in bed with savage Zionists good for business.
- lupusreal 1y ago
  That's part of it, but a relatively small part of it. Most of it is Christians who think they can force apocalyptic prophecies to come true by ensuring Israel's continued existence. The nature of their belief is such that it doesn't matter how badly Israel behaves, they will unconditionally support them.
  - DSingularity 1y ago
    I think hundreds of billions in dollars and unique testing bench for weapons development is a significant part. The fact that it has synergies with the American foreign policy for dominating the oil rich Middle East is also definitely another plus. It’s not just “oh the Israel lobby is strong”.
    - lupusreal 1y ago
      The Israelis don't buy that many weapons from America, either directly nor by having the American government buy and gift the weapons. It's significant, but weapon sales alone can't explain the fanaticism of American politicians in both parties and the American public. Weapon sales can't explain why states like Texas would pass laws requiring school teachers to swear oaths of loyalty to Israel. It can't explain why small town diners in rural America hang Israeli flags, or why America/Israel combined flag fridge magnets and patches are on sale at every truckstop. The American public are absolutely fanatical about Israel and it's mostly because of their insane religious beliefs, not because they're all invested in the defense industry. Look up figures for how much defense material Israel actually imports from America vs other countries. Have you ever heard of American politicians getting grilled at debates about how much they support Japan? Have you ever heard American politicians boasting that they support Qatar far more than their opponent? How many American politicians mention support for Australia during their campaign rallies? Support for Israel is a unique phenomenon in American politics, not merely a straight forward function of arms exports. It's because the American people have loyalty to Israel specifically, because their bibles say that Israel is important and say nothing about South Korea.
      - DSingularity 1y ago
        I would have guessed that significant quantities of weapons were purchased given the fact that the main workhorse of the Israeli Air Force is probably the American f15 and most of its munitions are American made. Not to mention the f35 and so on.

orblivion 1y ago

I'm responding to the general point that the administration just wants to destroy and not build. I'm saying that there's actually a good argument for that. Whether that's what's actually happening is ... now questionable. I don't know anything about UNESCO, but Palestine is a plausible answer to this administration's actual motivations here. But then that would be different from the simple "just wants to destroy" angle.