23 ms·

This isn't about Starfactory, the actual factory making rockets. It's about the whole of Starbase, a goddamned town/city under construction. That a massive con

This isn't about Starfactory, the actual factory making rockets. It's about the whole of Starbase, a goddamned town/city under construction. That a massive construction site with hundreds of welders and framers and plumbers and concrete workers, and linemen and ditch diggers, and survey workers and architects, and smiths and truck drivers and landscapers, and janitors and carpet layers and warehouse workers, and sewer workers, masons, electricians, and heavy equipment operators (massive cranes, bulldozers, man lifts, graders, boring rigs, excavators, etc.) most of them working outdoors in the TX weather, building dozen of homes, a rec center, factories, launch facilities, office buildings, apartment complexes, not to mention the largest ever space vehicles in volume numbers, has a higher injury rate than some ULA office workers sitting behind desks or in clean rooms building and launching a couple of classic rockets a year? Surprise, surprise.

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
echelon 1y ago
Maybe they can normalize for number of launches. I'd be curious if the number/rate is actually lower when adjusted for activity level. I just skimmed the article, but it looks like the rate is based on headcount, not productivity: > TRIR topped out at 4.27 injuries per 100 workers in 2024, when it employed an average of 2,690 workers, according to the data submitted to OSHA. Injured Starbase employees were unable to perform their normal job duties for a total of 3,558 restricted-duty days, plus 656 lost-time days where injuries made them unable to work at all. > Starbase is classified by the U.S. government as a space vehicle manufacturing operation. The injury rate in this sector has fallen dramatically since 1994, dropping from 4.2 injuries per 100 workers to 0.7 injuries per 100 workers in 2023, according to historical data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics. (BLS calculates these rates through its annual company surveys, which asks for the same information found in OSHA’s worker injury forms.) But despite major changes in safety processes across the industry, Starbase is closer to the rates of 30 years ago.
- asadotzler 1y ago
  It's not even about the rockets. This is a city being built. Hundreds of homes and apartments and a massive office building and a rec center and roads and roundabouts and launch pads and tank farms and inventory buildings, and yes, a rocket factory that makes and launches massive prototypes. Compare Starbase not to other rocket facilities but to large-scale construction projects. Then we'll have apples to apples injury rates. If you want to compare rocket factories, then only count injuries in the Starfactory itself, or factory+launch staff, or whatever. But comparing a city under construction with a long-completed launch facility and the offices used by the launch staff is disingenuous at best.
  - ceejayoz 1y ago
    I know SpaceX likes to make things in-house, but I really doubt that extends to residential subdivisions. That's what contractors are for.
  - queenkjuul 1y ago
    It only includes SpaceX employees and is adjusted for hours worked, and it's not only higher than other rocket facilities, but higher than the construction industry. It's actually not normal to see high injury rates on large construction sites in the US.
Terr_ 1y ago
> some UULA office workers sitting behind desks You believe OSHA's categorization of aerospace "manufacturing" facilities is wrong? Why?
- asadotzler 1y ago
  Yes. When ULA is building a rocket, they're in a many years old, long completed clean room assembly line with a few machinist stations. When they're launching, they have a tiny pad staff and medium office staff. Comparing those to the construction site that is Starbase, is apples to oranges.
  - TheOtherHobbes 1y ago
    As of mid-May the population was around 500, including around 120 kids. It voted itself a city for bureaucratic reasons, but a teeming metropolis it is not.
    - Terr_ 1y ago
      Plus the stats-in-question are already scaled by hours worked. (Which also renders the number of children moot, unless something illegal is going on.)
    - valianteffort 1y ago
      There are far more than 500 people working in Starbase. Most of them do not live there so it's kind of pointless to mention that.
      - queenkjuul 1y ago
        Not when the argument is that they're building homes for residents?
datadrivenangel 1y ago
BLS has the TRIR for the whole constructon industry as 2.3 per 100k, which is lower than starbase. [0] 0 - https://www.bls.gov/web/osh/table-1-industry-rates-national.htm https://www.bls.gov/web/osh/table-1-industry-rates-national....
jrflowers 1y ago
You make a good point. It should be compared to a generic construction project, where the incident rate is only roughly double the industry norm
gessha 1y ago
Smells like fanboy in here. The article mentions nothing about construction operations which makes sense since that is best contracted out. I can’t imagine Musk tolerating the hiring and layoffs of construction crews. The numbers in the article are based on SpaceX’s actual manufacturing facilities and operations. The highest injury rate seems to be in booster recovery operations with other facilities bringing the average down. > OSHA uses a standardized safety metric called Total Recordable Incident Rate (TRIR) to measure a company’s safety record and compare it to industry peers, like Blue Origin and United Launch Alliance. > Of the 14 OSHA inspections at SpaceX facilities over the past four years, six involved accidents and injuries at Starbase. That includes a partial finger amputation in 2021 and a crane collapse in June 2025. The latter inspection is still ongoing. Investigations by other news outlets including Reuters have uncovered hundreds of previously unreported worker injuries, including crushed limbs and one fatality.

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

echelon 1y ago

Maybe they can normalize for number of launches. I'd be curious if the number/rate is actually lower when adjusted for activity level. I just skimmed the article, but it looks like the rate is based on headcount, not productivity: > TRIR topped out at 4.27 injuries per 100 workers in 2024, when it employed an average of 2,690 workers, according to the data submitted to OSHA. Injured Starbase employees were unable to perform their normal job duties for a total of 3,558 restricted-duty days, plus 656 lost-time days where injuries made them unable to work at all. > Starbase is classified by the U.S. government as a space vehicle manufacturing operation. The injury rate in this sector has fallen dramatically since 1994, dropping from 4.2 injuries per 100 workers to 0.7 injuries per 100 workers in 2023, according to historical data from the Bureau of Labor Statistics. (BLS calculates these rates through its annual company surveys, which asks for the same information found in OSHA’s worker injury forms.) But despite major changes in safety processes across the industry, Starbase is closer to the rates of 30 years ago.

asadotzler 1y ago
It's not even about the rockets. This is a city being built. Hundreds of homes and apartments and a massive office building and a rec center and roads and roundabouts and launch pads and tank farms and inventory buildings, and yes, a rocket factory that makes and launches massive prototypes. Compare Starbase not to other rocket facilities but to large-scale construction projects. Then we'll have apples to apples injury rates. If you want to compare rocket factories, then only count injuries in the Starfactory itself, or factory+launch staff, or whatever. But comparing a city under construction with a long-completed launch facility and the offices used by the launch staff is disingenuous at best.
- ceejayoz 1y ago
  I know SpaceX likes to make things in-house, but I really doubt that extends to residential subdivisions. That's what contractors are for.
- queenkjuul 1y ago
  It only includes SpaceX employees and is adjusted for hours worked, and it's not only higher than other rocket facilities, but higher than the construction industry. It's actually not normal to see high injury rates on large construction sites in the US.

Terr_ 1y ago

> some UULA office workers sitting behind desks You believe OSHA's categorization of aerospace "manufacturing" facilities is wrong? Why?

asadotzler 1y ago
Yes. When ULA is building a rocket, they're in a many years old, long completed clean room assembly line with a few machinist stations. When they're launching, they have a tiny pad staff and medium office staff. Comparing those to the construction site that is Starbase, is apples to oranges.
- TheOtherHobbes 1y ago
  As of mid-May the population was around 500, including around 120 kids. It voted itself a city for bureaucratic reasons, but a teeming metropolis it is not.
  - Terr_ 1y ago
    Plus the stats-in-question are already scaled by hours worked. (Which also renders the number of children moot, unless something illegal is going on.)
  - valianteffort 1y ago
    There are far more than 500 people working in Starbase. Most of them do not live there so it's kind of pointless to mention that.
    - queenkjuul 1y ago
      Not when the argument is that they're building homes for residents?

datadrivenangel 1y ago

BLS has the TRIR for the whole constructon industry as 2.3 per 100k, which is lower than starbase. [0] 0 - https://www.bls.gov/web/osh/table-1-industry-rates-national.htm https://www.bls.gov/web/osh/table-1-industry-rates-national....

jrflowers 1y ago

You make a good point. It should be compared to a generic construction project, where the incident rate is only roughly double the industry norm

gessha 1y ago

Smells like fanboy in here. The article mentions nothing about construction operations which makes sense since that is best contracted out. I can’t imagine Musk tolerating the hiring and layoffs of construction crews. The numbers in the article are based on SpaceX’s actual manufacturing facilities and operations. The highest injury rate seems to be in booster recovery operations with other facilities bringing the average down. > OSHA uses a standardized safety metric called Total Recordable Incident Rate (TRIR) to measure a company’s safety record and compare it to industry peers, like Blue Origin and United Launch Alliance. > Of the 14 OSHA inspections at SpaceX facilities over the past four years, six involved accidents and injuries at Starbase. That includes a partial finger amputation in 2021 and a crane collapse in June 2025. The latter inspection is still ongoing. Investigations by other news outlets including Reuters have uncovered hundreds of previously unreported worker injuries, including crushed limbs and one fatality.