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Lived in London for over 40 years. Never let your stuff out of sight for a minute. My foot always goes through a loop on my bag. Had at least two attempts to gr
by crinkly 1y ago
Lived in London for over 40 years. Never let your stuff out of sight for a minute. My foot always goes through a loop on my bag. Had at least two attempts to grab it which was stopped dead by this. I use a knackered looking Osprey daylite plus bag which has straps around the zips that stops people casually having a go at it as well. Mostly no issues in the last 10 years but I know people who are careless and have been done a few times.
My general travel experience, outside the UK, is that if you dress down, use a knackered looking bag and a shitty no brand knackered phone case and people will leave you alone. Passport goes on you in a zipped inner pocket anywhere on the planet. Same with wallet, keys, anything. Never wear anything that indicates you have an iPhone worth nicking. Apple Watch / Airpods make you a target.
Many people aren't travel savvy. It scares me.
- olalonde 1y agoOne thing that really struck me in Dubai: I watched a group of girls leave their designer purses and phones unattended on a table. They just left the coffee shop and came back over 10 minutes later.
- dr_dshiv 1y agoI was encouraged to leave my wallet and phone on the table of time out, while we went and got food. My friends rationale was: there are CCTVs everywhere and thieves are dealt with very harshly. So eff it
- ghaff 1y agoEven in Singapore, I recall the protocol being to leave a napkin or whatever at a Hawker Center to indicate the chair/table was taken. Been a few years though.
- firtoz 1y agoIn Dubai the punishment I'd expect to be much worse if you do end up getting caught stealing.
- atlasunshrugged 1y agoFrom your and other comments in the thread, it sounds like the main deterrence then is 1) that it's likely you'll be caught and 2) that if caught, the punishment will be quite harsh. I wonder if the UK and other cities are struggling more with the first or second
- defrost 1y agoI've travelled to a majority of countries across the globe (exploration geophysics, mostly in the air or deep backcountry, rarely in major cities) and Dubai is another city within a city location; two state; the rich are rich and have no need to steal, or are brazen about it, while the poor are segregated, curfewed and routinely castigated. These are not places were you want to fall the wrong side of the invisible barrier.
- olalonde 1y agoThis dynamic exists in many expensive locations around the world, but Dubai stands out for its remarkably low crime rate. Take San Francisco, for instance. More expensive to live and greater wealth inequality, yet riddled with crime.
- 542354234235 1y agoIt isn't the expense; it is the segregation. The poor just aren't allowed to exist or mingle with the rich in Dubai. If you are poor, you are only near the rich while you are at work, performing a job.
- olalonde 1y agoWhat do you mean by that? It's the same kind of segregation that exists in San Francisco: expensive areas are out of reach to those without money. There aren't actual laws enforcing segregation. In fact, it's almost the opposite - it's pretty easy to come and live in Dubai.
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- gamblor956 1y agoTheft is punished very severely there. Not worth the risk.
- fakedang 1y agoI can safely walk around the streets at 2 am in a "bad" neighbourhood in Dubai or Singapore. Can't do the same in most Western cities. I'd gladly trade a little bit of freedom (the freedom to criticize a government that isn't even mine) in exchange for this massive improvement in security. Apparently a lot of Western entrepreneurs are feeling the same way lately. On a side note, a friend who used to work in the Dubai Police told me that even they're getting swamped with the rapid increase in population, and even they're getting subjected to budget cuts of late. There used to be a time when part of the police force was even foreign, but those positions were eliminated in favor of a UAE-nationals-only force.
- rurban 1y agoThat would happen in Germany too. Or Japan. Or Austria. Or most parts of Italy
- olalonde 1y agoMaybe in less touristy areas it's safer, but from what I've seen in many European cities, even what's in your pockets isn't safe.
- tomatocracy 1y agoI had a similar experience in Korea recently. Going for lunch in a shopping mall, many people were routinely placing their phones on tables to "reserve" them while they walked off (out of sight of their phones/tables) to collect their food. I couldn't quite believe it!
- codezero 1y agoGlad to hear I'm not the only one who always has the loop around their foot! Minimal inconvenience for the potential loss.
- olalonde 1y agoJust a heads up - there seems to be an issue with your HN account. Nearly all of your comments are showing up as dead.
- codezero 1y agoYeah I’m pretty sure I got limited because I said multiple stupid things, appreciate the heads up but I’ll take my punishment :)
- clickety_clack 1y agoYou can’t leave your comments out of your sight for a second around here!
- atlasunshrugged 1y agoWow, I have to say it's a bit crazy that you have to go through all this effort in what I think of as quite a safe city. I was recently in London for a week of meetings and someone said be careful about having your phone out in case someone snatches it but I thought they were being hyperbolic. Why isn't there a bigger crackdown on such petty crime? I guess people think they can get away with it, but it feels like one of those creeping issues that might seem small at first but deters important activity (tourism, business relocation, etc.) longterm if not addressed.
- secondcoming 1y agoBecause the police don't care, and these crimes are generally impossible to solve. There are stories of people finding their stolen bicycles, motorbikes or cars, and when informing the police they're told to 'steal it back'. The phones thieves are generally youths riding around the city on electric bikes, fully balaclava'd up. There's little chance of catching them. Even if they were caught nothing would happen to them. London has apparently gone to shit since I lived there 5 years ago.
- throwawayffffas 1y ago> Because the police don't care, and these crimes are generally impossible to solve. Because they don't care is correct. These crimes are actually trivial to solve. The devices are tracked, there is a clear money trail, people are doing this routinely as a business. As you said people routinely track their stolen property and nothing is done about it. They don't care because it's "petty" crime. And they will "get to it after they solve all the murders."
- tomatocracy 1y agoYes. The police have the ability to find and arrest the perpetrators pretty quickly, if they prioritise it. There was a phone theft which (unusually) turned into a stabbing/slashing a couple of years ago when the victim fought back. Perpetrators escaped on bikes before police arrived, but were arrested only 3 or 4 days later. https://www.cityoflondon.police.uk/news/city-of-london/news/2022/october/arrest-in-connection-with-bishopsgate-attempted-robbery-and-knife-attack/ https://www.cityoflondon.police.uk/news/city-of-london/news/...
- dataflow 1y agoOut of curiosity, how would you compare London to NYC?
- crinkly 1y agoHaven’t been to NYC for about 1 10 years but basically about the same. I don’t know NYC as well so felt a little uneasy which was my own bias.
- ghaff 1y agoBeing somewhat familiar with both, there are probably areas of both cities that are more and less safe. Without looking at numbers, there are probably areas of NYC that I'd be less inclined to wander into than areas of London. Though, as you say, bias. There are areas of London that were sketchy a few decades back that are pretty gentrified today, especially in East London.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]