5 ms·

ICANN fumes as AFRINIC offers no explanation for annulled election

148 points by rntn 1y ago

JdeBP 1y ago
Thanks to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44517053 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44517053 and https://techdirt.com/2025/07/09/litigious-company-demands-removal-of-a-tweet-linking-to-an-article-about-how-litigious-they-are/ https://techdirt.com/2025/07/09/litigious-company-demands-re... I now know what The Register was being so surprisingly careful about.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- alienthrowaway 1y ago
  I was surprised the Register didn't provide the additional context of AFRINIC's revocation of Cloud Innovations IP4 blocks that were being sold anywhere but Africa[1][2][3]. 1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43753738 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43753738 2. Now-deleted report on involved parties by South African news org https://archive.is/bcSDY https://archive.is/bcSDY 3. https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/172579/cloud-innovations-ip-space-is-going-to-be-revoked-by-afrinic https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/172579/cloud-innovations-i...
  - marrickvillain2 1y ago
    FYI The Reg has covered the back story - https://www.theregister.com/2023/07/03/nrs_afrinic_review/ https://www.theregister.com/2023/07/03/nrs_afrinic_review/ - but suffice to say anything written about Cloud Innovation quickly attracts the attention of its lawyers. But evidence is being collected and the full story will one day be told.
mkj 1y ago
Who are cloud innovation's IP address range customers?
- harvey9 1y ago
  Other articles suggest data centers outside of Africa
  - mkj 1y ago
    Is that legal?
    - MaxPock 1y ago
      Some corrupt employee sold millions of IPs to this guy and he's been reselling them outside of Africa .
      - jfengel 1y ago
        Is that covered by any actual law? Is some government entity responsible? Or is it just an anarchy breaking down?
        lagniappe 1y ago
        Its Africa
        lazide 1y ago
        No one wants to get a sovereign country involved in these issues if they can avoid it, because that is an even more giant can of worms. Because then it’s ’whose laws again?’. And all these matters cross every international boundary as a matter of course. Unfortunately, it is also enabling this particular situation.
        jfengel 1y ago
        Ah. It sounds like another case where the Internet was built assuming a fair bit of goodwill on behalf of its users. Until we realized that it means that the worst 0.01% now have access to everyone in the world.
this15testing 1y ago
it's all this guy: https://heng.lu/ https://heng.lu/ who is very outspoken against IPv6 adoption because he wants to capitalize on his v4 holdings. THE END. I don't know if I've heard a sentence from him that isn't a threat of legal action for something
- Y_Y 1y ago
  But he earned those addresses by the sweat of his brow! He's entitled to whatever the market will bear and more, because numbers aren't free!
- Loughla 1y ago
  I don't know who that guy is, but if he's against IPv6, why does he say; >promotes accountable leadership, fair market practices, and adoption of the next generation of IPv6 addresses.
  - viraptor 1y ago
    Why is NK called Democratic People's Republic if it's not? The marketing copy can say whatever it needs to.
    - sethops1 1y ago
      And America isn't a democracy, it's a Republic.
      - yndoendo 1y ago
        When the Presided of the USA is no longer bound by the Constitution, written law, it is no longer.
        thyristan 1y ago
        Funnily enough, it isn't even a constitutional monarchy then, it regresses beyond that to an absolute monarchy.
pityJuke 1y ago
As someone entirely unfamiliar with everything here: can ICANN actually do anything to resolve this situation, and I imagine, ideally retrieve the IPs from this unsavoury individual?
- __turbobrew__ 1y ago
  It’s in the article > ICANN’s letter references a policy [PDF] that allows it to appoint an emergency replacement for a dysfunctional RIR, and states that ICANN reserves all rights to start the process that would make that possible.
  - pityJuke 1y ago
    I'm interested why Cloud Innovation say that this is also their preferred ending [0]. A double-bluff? [0]: https://cloudinnovation.org/cloudinnovation-call-AFRINIC-wind-up-amid-election-impasse.html https://cloudinnovation.org/cloudinnovation-call-AFRINIC-win...
    - __turbobrew__ 1y ago
      It could be a bet that Cloud Innovation would fare better under an ICANN takeover vs AFRNIC re-establishing control? From some articles I have read, the providence of how Cloud Innovation got their IP blocks is either lost or unknown, so maybe they are betting that if ICANN took over they would not touch Cloud Innovation blocks as the windup of AFRINIC would cause records to be lost? Or it could be a bet that AFRINIC will eventually re-assert control, so the best thing you can do is try to muddy the waters and raise questions about AFRINICs legitimately which will add more procedural muck and further delay control.
oncallthrow 1y ago
AFRINIC is an utterly incompetent organisation and should be disbanded. Its resources should be managed by one of the other RIRs.
- betaby 1y ago
  Well, that was the case before 2004.
huslage 1y ago
I’ve posted about this saga on LinkedIn a bunch of times and received a cease and desist every time. These people are rent seeking fools who are holding African addresses hostage for profit.
__turbobrew__ 1y ago
More context: https://medium.com/@emmanuelvitus/afrinic-hope-hijack-and-the-harsh-lessons-of-african-multistakeholderism-8e8378797101 https://medium.com/@emmanuelvitus/afrinic-hope-hijack-and-th...
xacky 1y ago
The only long term solution is to ban ipv4 sales and tell anyone who wants new ip addresses to get ipv6. IPv4 is a security risk now with all sorts of malicious traffic routed through cgnat proxies.

148 points by rntn 1y ago

Thanks to https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44517053 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44517053 and https://techdirt.com/2025/07/09/litigious-company-demands-removal-of-a-tweet-linking-to-an-article-about-how-litigious-they-are/ https://techdirt.com/2025/07/09/litigious-company-demands-re... I now know what The Register was being so surprisingly careful about.

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
alienthrowaway 1y ago
I was surprised the Register didn't provide the additional context of AFRINIC's revocation of Cloud Innovations IP4 blocks that were being sold anywhere but Africa[1][2][3]. 1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43753738 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43753738 2. Now-deleted report on involved parties by South African news org https://archive.is/bcSDY https://archive.is/bcSDY 3. https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/172579/cloud-innovations-ip-space-is-going-to-be-revoked-by-afrinic https://lowendtalk.com/discussion/172579/cloud-innovations-i...
- marrickvillain2 1y ago
  FYI The Reg has covered the back story - https://www.theregister.com/2023/07/03/nrs_afrinic_review/ https://www.theregister.com/2023/07/03/nrs_afrinic_review/ - but suffice to say anything written about Cloud Innovation quickly attracts the attention of its lawyers. But evidence is being collected and the full story will one day be told.

mkj 1y ago

Who are cloud innovation's IP address range customers?

harvey9 1y ago
Other articles suggest data centers outside of Africa
- mkj 1y ago
  Is that legal?
  - MaxPock 1y ago
    Some corrupt employee sold millions of IPs to this guy and he's been reselling them outside of Africa .
    - jfengel 1y ago
      Is that covered by any actual law? Is some government entity responsible? Or is it just an anarchy breaking down?
      - lagniappe 1y ago
        Its Africa
      - lazide 1y ago
        No one wants to get a sovereign country involved in these issues if they can avoid it, because that is an even more giant can of worms. Because then it’s ’whose laws again?’. And all these matters cross every international boundary as a matter of course. Unfortunately, it is also enabling this particular situation.
        jfengel 1y ago
        Ah. It sounds like another case where the Internet was built assuming a fair bit of goodwill on behalf of its users. Until we realized that it means that the worst 0.01% now have access to everyone in the world.

this15testing 1y ago

it's all this guy: https://heng.lu/ https://heng.lu/ who is very outspoken against IPv6 adoption because he wants to capitalize on his v4 holdings. THE END. I don't know if I've heard a sentence from him that isn't a threat of legal action for something

Y_Y 1y ago
But he earned those addresses by the sweat of his brow! He's entitled to whatever the market will bear and more, because numbers aren't free!
Loughla 1y ago
I don't know who that guy is, but if he's against IPv6, why does he say; >promotes accountable leadership, fair market practices, and adoption of the next generation of IPv6 addresses.
- viraptor 1y ago
  Why is NK called Democratic People's Republic if it's not? The marketing copy can say whatever it needs to.
  - sethops1 1y ago
    And America isn't a democracy, it's a Republic.
    - yndoendo 1y ago
      When the Presided of the USA is no longer bound by the Constitution, written law, it is no longer.
      - thyristan 1y ago
        Funnily enough, it isn't even a constitutional monarchy then, it regresses beyond that to an absolute monarchy.

pityJuke 1y ago

As someone entirely unfamiliar with everything here: can ICANN actually do anything to resolve this situation, and I imagine, ideally retrieve the IPs from this unsavoury individual?

__turbobrew__ 1y ago
It’s in the article > ICANN’s letter references a policy [PDF] that allows it to appoint an emergency replacement for a dysfunctional RIR, and states that ICANN reserves all rights to start the process that would make that possible.
- pityJuke 1y ago
  I'm interested why Cloud Innovation say that this is also their preferred ending [0]. A double-bluff? [0]: https://cloudinnovation.org/cloudinnovation-call-AFRINIC-wind-up-amid-election-impasse.html https://cloudinnovation.org/cloudinnovation-call-AFRINIC-win...
  - __turbobrew__ 1y ago
    It could be a bet that Cloud Innovation would fare better under an ICANN takeover vs AFRNIC re-establishing control? From some articles I have read, the providence of how Cloud Innovation got their IP blocks is either lost or unknown, so maybe they are betting that if ICANN took over they would not touch Cloud Innovation blocks as the windup of AFRINIC would cause records to be lost? Or it could be a bet that AFRINIC will eventually re-assert control, so the best thing you can do is try to muddy the waters and raise questions about AFRINICs legitimately which will add more procedural muck and further delay control.

oncallthrow 1y ago

AFRINIC is an utterly incompetent organisation and should be disbanded. Its resources should be managed by one of the other RIRs.

betaby 1y ago
Well, that was the case before 2004.

huslage 1y ago

I’ve posted about this saga on LinkedIn a bunch of times and received a cease and desist every time. These people are rent seeking fools who are holding African addresses hostage for profit.

__turbobrew__ 1y ago

More context: https://medium.com/@emmanuelvitus/afrinic-hope-hijack-and-the-harsh-lessons-of-african-multistakeholderism-8e8378797101 https://medium.com/@emmanuelvitus/afrinic-hope-hijack-and-th...

xacky 1y ago

The only long term solution is to ban ipv4 sales and tell anyone who wants new ip addresses to get ipv6. IPv4 is a security risk now with all sorts of malicious traffic routed through cgnat proxies.