3 ms·

A rodent chewing on wires. Vibration-induced chafing. Tin whiskers causing an intermittent short. There are many possibilities, those came to mind first.

apical_dendrite 1y ago
We know that the switches physically moved from the run to the cutoff position because one of the pilots noted that they were in the wrong position. We know that they were moved back to the run position because they found in that position. I don't understand how a short could explain that - it really seems like someone would have had to physically move the switches.
- fyrn_ 1y ago
  Do we know that the pilot noticed they were in the wrong physical position, or did some other status indicate the engie fuel had been cut? I would be surprised if there was only one channel for this information
  - shash 1y ago
    In the last mentour pilot livestream, they showed the simulator and both engines, and there's a little graphic near the cutoffs showing engine state and performance. Also, in _this_ livestream as soon as the report was released, Ben mentions in response to a question that if you cut off the engine, a lot of electrical systems are going to face power cuts, so there will be alarms blaring all over the cockpit. So, yes. There are many channels of information here.
- shash 1y ago
  What we have is reported speech: "In the cockpit voice recording, one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff. The other pilot responded that he did not do so." So we don't know the exact words used. Did he say for example, "Why did you move the switches to cutoff" or did he ask "Why did you cut off the engines"? If there are indeed two shorts (astronomically low as those probabilities are), the other pilot would say "I didn't", look around confused and then (possibly?) flip both of them down and back up? Which could explain the 4s delay in pulling them back up. Speculation, but since we do not have actual transcripts or recordings, all I'm doing is answering speculation with more speculation.
mr_toad 1y ago
It amazes me that some people can ever make it out the door if they spend all their lives contemplating a series of increasingly unlikely possibilities.
Epa095 1y ago
But why does the pilot then comment that they are in the CUTTOF position and move it to RUN? A mechanical failure would have to also move the physical switch in the cockpit for the audio recording to make sence.
- userbinator 1y ago
  You have the exact CVR audio? The report says "one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff" which I interpreted to mean one of them noticed the engines shutting down, and asked the other if he did that.
  - bronson 1y ago
    Then he would have asked the other pilot why the engines are shutting down. It seems a lot more probable that he glanced at the switches before asking such an explicit question.
    - userbinator 1y ago
      Without listening to the CVR audio and knowing what they actually said, there's no evidence either way, and AFAIK they have not released that.
      - bronson 1y ago
        From the preliminary report, quote: "In the cockpit voice recording, one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff. The other pilot responded that he did not do so." I'm trying to understand your complaint here... you think you need to hear their voices with your own ears to believe it?

apical_dendrite 1y ago

We know that the switches physically moved from the run to the cutoff position because one of the pilots noted that they were in the wrong position. We know that they were moved back to the run position because they found in that position. I don't understand how a short could explain that - it really seems like someone would have had to physically move the switches.

fyrn_ 1y ago
Do we know that the pilot noticed they were in the wrong physical position, or did some other status indicate the engie fuel had been cut? I would be surprised if there was only one channel for this information
- shash 1y ago
  In the last mentour pilot livestream, they showed the simulator and both engines, and there's a little graphic near the cutoffs showing engine state and performance. Also, in _this_ livestream as soon as the report was released, Ben mentions in response to a question that if you cut off the engine, a lot of electrical systems are going to face power cuts, so there will be alarms blaring all over the cockpit. So, yes. There are many channels of information here.
shash 1y ago
What we have is reported speech: "In the cockpit voice recording, one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff. The other pilot responded that he did not do so." So we don't know the exact words used. Did he say for example, "Why did you move the switches to cutoff" or did he ask "Why did you cut off the engines"? If there are indeed two shorts (astronomically low as those probabilities are), the other pilot would say "I didn't", look around confused and then (possibly?) flip both of them down and back up? Which could explain the 4s delay in pulling them back up. Speculation, but since we do not have actual transcripts or recordings, all I'm doing is answering speculation with more speculation.

mr_toad 1y ago

It amazes me that some people can ever make it out the door if they spend all their lives contemplating a series of increasingly unlikely possibilities.

Epa095 1y ago

But why does the pilot then comment that they are in the CUTTOF position and move it to RUN? A mechanical failure would have to also move the physical switch in the cockpit for the audio recording to make sence.

userbinator 1y ago
You have the exact CVR audio? The report says "one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff" which I interpreted to mean one of them noticed the engines shutting down, and asked the other if he did that.
- bronson 1y ago
  Then he would have asked the other pilot why the engines are shutting down. It seems a lot more probable that he glanced at the switches before asking such an explicit question.
  - userbinator 1y ago
    Without listening to the CVR audio and knowing what they actually said, there's no evidence either way, and AFAIK they have not released that.
    - bronson 1y ago
      From the preliminary report, quote: "In the cockpit voice recording, one of the pilots is heard asking the other why did he cutoff. The other pilot responded that he did not do so." I'm trying to understand your complaint here... you think you need to hear their voices with your own ears to believe it?