4 ms·

Xorg Neglect and XLibre Slander

12 points by wicket 1y ago

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
CJefferson 1y ago
To me, this whole article feel clearly biased. Obviously reverts happen, in everything. That doesn't mean there aren't developers who are bad, who make untested commits which obviously and immediately break things, and need reverting more than usual. If you want to defend XLibre, then show us that the number of reverts is standard, or (better!) that the reverts are for subtle issues (like the futex one you linked, it required a significant amount of benchmarking to find!), and isn't just that the code never worked at all. Saying "Oh, but things get reverted in other systems" means nothing at all, and it's what you spend most of the time talking about.
bitwize 1y ago
> One would be tempted to say that perhaps they have a vested interest in making it seem like Xorg can not be fixed, even though this patch was merged in 2022, normal users still cannot use this feature in 2025. This has passed into the "yes, it's happening, and here's why it's a good thing" phase of conspiracy-theory damage control: https://mastodon.social/@alatiera/114661446785833161 https://mastodon.social/@alatiera/114661446785833161 The Xorg developers do not want to maintain the legacy X codebase. They do not want to perpetuate the legacy X architecture. If withholding features is what finally gets people to suck it up and switch to Wayland, if it gets app and toolkit developers and fucking NVIDIA to drop their X codepaths and put all their development effort behind Wayland, that's what they will do. Apple, Microsoft, and Google do this all the time. They drop support for the old and busted and put all their effort into the new hotness. By and large, their user bases do not complain. Only Linux users are autistic enough to go "but muh 40-year-old 'network transparent' [lol, not really, watch the Daniel Stone talk again please] display server written for 8bpp framebuffers long before modern fucking GPUs emerged". As for Xlibre... to give you an idea of how clownshoes the development community is on that thing... https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/pull/56 https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/pull/56 Not to mention being a Nazi bar. People are starting to wake up and realize what a security risk Nazi- and far-right-authored code is. Alpine already has a security exclusion on it for that reason. Other distros will follow suit.
- anthk 1y ago
  Xenocara and NetBSD's X server are good enough.
  - bitwize 1y ago
    Those track Xorg's development, which is moribund.
- anonfordays 1y ago
  >Not to mention being a Nazi bar It's not a Nazi bar, it's the complete opposite of that by welcoming anyone from any race and background. Ends up even worse, Wayland and Freedesktop are pedo bars, and they've been projecting about "safe spaces" this entire time. They were harboring a violent sexual predator. The Mastodon profile you linked is to a profile with ghoulish antisemitic screeds. Delusionally calling anyone and anything you disagree with "Nazi" and "far-right" has run its course.
  - throwaway7356 1y ago
    Meanwhile on the Xlibre mailing list: https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Proposal-Standards-for-respectful-and-civilized-communication,16 https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Proposal-Standards-for... The official telegram also has antisemetic memes, messages mentioning "gene therapies" for COVID and other stuff that doesn't seem problematic to moderators. I guess it is "normal" for the community there given the Xlibre founder posts stuff like https://web.archive.org/web/20190404153507/https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20181010.191925.ee1331b6.en.html https://web.archive.org/web/20190404153507/https://lists.dyn..., 9/11 truther or anti-vax conspiracy stuff himself. From outside it looks like something one would not want to interact with.
    - anonfordays 1y ago
      >Meanwhile on the Xlibre mailing list: You mean the troll that in that same thread is called out for being an off-topic spammer and blocked? https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Proposal-Standards-for-respectful-and-civilized-communication,10 https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Proposal-Standards-for... You're making the case for Xlibre here lol. >The official telegram also has antisemetic memes Yes, leftist spammers are posting antisemitic memes and getting banned, nothing new. >"gene therapies" for COVID and other stuff that doesn't seem problematic to moderators. Similarly being called out for being off topic. Meanwhile, at Freedesktop.org and Debian: https://youtube.com/watch?v=ehEoRkMtoT8 https://youtube.com/watch?v=ehEoRkMtoT8 >I guess it is "normal" for the community there given the Xlibre founder posts stuff like I guess it is "normal" for the freedesktop.org and Debian community given one of the Debconf25 main stage speakers and Debian release managers is a convicted violent pedophile that they're platforming: https://www.offenderradar.com/offender-details/jeremy-c-bicha-of-florida-176493 https://www.offenderradar.com/offender-details/jeremy-c-bich... From outside it looks like something one would not want to interact with.

12 points by wicket 1y ago

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

To me, this whole article feel clearly biased. Obviously reverts happen, in everything. That doesn't mean there aren't developers who are bad, who make untested commits which obviously and immediately break things, and need reverting more than usual. If you want to defend XLibre, then show us that the number of reverts is standard, or (better!) that the reverts are for subtle issues (like the futex one you linked, it required a significant amount of benchmarking to find!), and isn't just that the code never worked at all. Saying "Oh, but things get reverted in other systems" means nothing at all, and it's what you spend most of the time talking about.

bitwize 1y ago

> One would be tempted to say that perhaps they have a vested interest in making it seem like Xorg can not be fixed, even though this patch was merged in 2022, normal users still cannot use this feature in 2025. This has passed into the "yes, it's happening, and here's why it's a good thing" phase of conspiracy-theory damage control: https://mastodon.social/@alatiera/114661446785833161 https://mastodon.social/@alatiera/114661446785833161 The Xorg developers do not want to maintain the legacy X codebase. They do not want to perpetuate the legacy X architecture. If withholding features is what finally gets people to suck it up and switch to Wayland, if it gets app and toolkit developers and fucking NVIDIA to drop their X codepaths and put all their development effort behind Wayland, that's what they will do. Apple, Microsoft, and Google do this all the time. They drop support for the old and busted and put all their effort into the new hotness. By and large, their user bases do not complain. Only Linux users are autistic enough to go "but muh 40-year-old 'network transparent' [lol, not really, watch the Daniel Stone talk again please] display server written for 8bpp framebuffers long before modern fucking GPUs emerged". As for Xlibre... to give you an idea of how clownshoes the development community is on that thing... https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/pull/56 https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/pull/56 Not to mention being a Nazi bar. People are starting to wake up and realize what a security risk Nazi- and far-right-authored code is. Alpine already has a security exclusion on it for that reason. Other distros will follow suit.

anthk 1y ago
Xenocara and NetBSD's X server are good enough.
- bitwize 1y ago
  Those track Xorg's development, which is moribund.
anonfordays 1y ago
>Not to mention being a Nazi bar It's not a Nazi bar, it's the complete opposite of that by welcoming anyone from any race and background. Ends up even worse, Wayland and Freedesktop are pedo bars, and they've been projecting about "safe spaces" this entire time. They were harboring a violent sexual predator. The Mastodon profile you linked is to a profile with ghoulish antisemitic screeds. Delusionally calling anyone and anything you disagree with "Nazi" and "far-right" has run its course.
- throwaway7356 1y ago
  Meanwhile on the Xlibre mailing list: https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Proposal-Standards-for-respectful-and-civilized-communication,16 https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Proposal-Standards-for... The official telegram also has antisemetic memes, messages mentioning "gene therapies" for COVID and other stuff that doesn't seem problematic to moderators. I guess it is "normal" for the community there given the Xlibre founder posts stuff like https://web.archive.org/web/20190404153507/https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20181010.191925.ee1331b6.en.html https://web.archive.org/web/20190404153507/https://lists.dyn..., 9/11 truther or anti-vax conspiracy stuff himself. From outside it looks like something one would not want to interact with.
  - anonfordays 1y ago
    >Meanwhile on the Xlibre mailing list: You mean the troll that in that same thread is called out for being an off-topic spammer and blocked? https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Proposal-Standards-for-respectful-and-civilized-communication,10 https://www.freelists.org/post/xlibre/Proposal-Standards-for... You're making the case for Xlibre here lol. >The official telegram also has antisemetic memes Yes, leftist spammers are posting antisemitic memes and getting banned, nothing new. >"gene therapies" for COVID and other stuff that doesn't seem problematic to moderators. Similarly being called out for being off topic. Meanwhile, at Freedesktop.org and Debian: https://youtube.com/watch?v=ehEoRkMtoT8 https://youtube.com/watch?v=ehEoRkMtoT8 >I guess it is "normal" for the community there given the Xlibre founder posts stuff like I guess it is "normal" for the freedesktop.org and Debian community given one of the Debconf25 main stage speakers and Debian release managers is a convicted violent pedophile that they're platforming: https://www.offenderradar.com/offender-details/jeremy-c-bicha-of-florida-176493 https://www.offenderradar.com/offender-details/jeremy-c-bich... From outside it looks like something one would not want to interact with.