3 ms·

Diesel has a lot of impurities. Methane is just one molecule.

rini17 1y ago
If it were so easy just better refine the fuel why would Europeans bother to add these converters and adblue injectors? No it's not impurities, but high pressure/temperature combustion. The higher the more efficient and more NOx comes out.
- msgodel 1y ago
  Europe does all kinds of things, basing your understanding of chemistry around what a state does rather than the other way around is literally insane.
  - ndsipa_pomu 1y ago
    However, it's not insane to look at what experts put in place and consider that there are reasons why they have done that. Yes, experts can be wrong or are forced to make sub-optimal decisions, but it's worth examining their thinking behind the decisions.
    - msgodel 1y ago
      It is always science -> experts. NOT the other way around.
      - ndsipa_pomu 1y ago
        In theory, yes. In practise, the experts will also consider real-world constraints (e.g. cost, planning, staffing etc). Also, taking the advice/opinion of respected experts (i.e. not YouTube experts) is a short-cut to spending years studying the science (that they had to do) yourself and that's even assuming that you can reach the same level of competency as them.
audiofish 1y ago
There are multiple NOx sources during combustion. Fuel NOx is only one of them, which you quite rightly point out is not dominant in methane combustion due to the rarity of nitrogen in the fuel. The dominant source in methane combustion is thermal NOx, which forms due to the extreme temperature of the combustion, causing atmospheric nitrogen to decompose and react with atmospheric oxygen. Source: https://www.epa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-09/documents/1.4_natural_gas_combustion.pdf https://www.epa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-09/documents/1....
numpad0 1y ago
It's impurities in oxidizer. 80% of air is N2, 20% O2. N2 + O2 -> NOx minus some kJ(endothermic). Means, run plain air through anything hot and NOx comes out. Doesn't matter how pure the fuel, doesn't have to be an ICE, doesn't need fuel at all. Hot stuff in the air = NOx.

If it were so easy just better refine the fuel why would Europeans bother to add these converters and adblue injectors? No it's not impurities, but high pressure/temperature combustion. The higher the more efficient and more NOx comes out.

msgodel 1y ago
Europe does all kinds of things, basing your understanding of chemistry around what a state does rather than the other way around is literally insane.
- ndsipa_pomu 1y ago
  However, it's not insane to look at what experts put in place and consider that there are reasons why they have done that. Yes, experts can be wrong or are forced to make sub-optimal decisions, but it's worth examining their thinking behind the decisions.
  - msgodel 1y ago
    It is always science -> experts. NOT the other way around.
    - ndsipa_pomu 1y ago
      In theory, yes. In practise, the experts will also consider real-world constraints (e.g. cost, planning, staffing etc). Also, taking the advice/opinion of respected experts (i.e. not YouTube experts) is a short-cut to spending years studying the science (that they had to do) yourself and that's even assuming that you can reach the same level of competency as them.

audiofish 1y ago

There are multiple NOx sources during combustion. Fuel NOx is only one of them, which you quite rightly point out is not dominant in methane combustion due to the rarity of nitrogen in the fuel. The dominant source in methane combustion is thermal NOx, which forms due to the extreme temperature of the combustion, causing atmospheric nitrogen to decompose and react with atmospheric oxygen. Source: https://www.epa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-09/documents/1.4_natural_gas_combustion.pdf https://www.epa.gov/sites/default/files/2020-09/documents/1....

numpad0 1y ago

It's impurities in oxidizer. 80% of air is N2, 20% O2. N2 + O2 -> NOx minus some kJ(endothermic). Means, run plain air through anything hot and NOx comes out. Doesn't matter how pure the fuel, doesn't have to be an ICE, doesn't need fuel at all. Hot stuff in the air = NOx.