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I drive an electric car and I've been advocating against carbon based energy sources for decades. I'm the first to take a stance. That said, this piece is an ob

I drive an electric car and I've been advocating against carbon based energy sources for decades. I'm the first to take a stance. That said, this piece is an obvious hit piece on Elon Musk. Not only do they mention xAI is Elon's company right at the beginning, they also throw the race card in right after. They claim that the xAI air pollution disproportionately affects black neighbourhoods. I'm no Elon fan, but I can not think of a single human who has done more to reduce dependence on fossil fuels. This is not reporting. This is a hit piece.

DamonHD 1y ago
Many people seem to discount pollution etc that only affects brown-ish people far away that they personally don't know. And guess in which places these kind of stunts are commonly pulled? You wouldn't plonk an illegally fume-belching data centre in a rich white 'hood even if there was plenty of electricity, because political power is the key lever. (I am a 'rich' white western man, FWIW.)
- rbanffy 1y ago
  You make a great point - pollution sources are often located on cheap land that's occupied, predominantly, by poor people, which, in most of the world, correlates with non-whites. Would something like Flint have happened in Scarsdale or Los Altos? Of course not.
  - dotancohen 1y ago
    So this is an economic issue, not a race issue. The two are correlated (everything is correlated to something in a complex system), but to reduce the issue the actual economic factors are to be considered. Not the racial factors. Or would it be fine if xAI were polluting a poor white neighbourhood?
    - DamonHD 1y ago
      We shouldn't be dumping pollution selectively in poor places at all. But it is not coincidence: there is a lot of systematic racism (and other discrimination) in the world and in the US on top of that, that keeps not-white (and not 'Christian', not het, not male, not English-speaking) people not rich. The variables are not independent. Skin colour is prominent in treating some humans as less than human.
      - dotancohen 1y ago
        Well I'm three of your "not"s, my grandfather was a slave, and I still don't see this as a race issue.
amitrip 1y ago
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richrichardsson 1y ago
> I can not think of a single human who has done more to reduce dependence on fossil fuels I'm struggling to see how it's a single human that is responsible when they just invested in companies?
- dotancohen 1y ago
  From what I understand that was not only financial investment. Aren't there stories of the guy sleeping on the factory floor trying to diagnose production issues?
sReinwald 1y ago
The article reports that xAI operated gas turbines without required permits and pollution controls for over a year. That's not a "hit piece" - it's documenting regulatory violations with thermal imaging evidence and official permit records. If this were actually a hit piece on Musk, wouldn't his name be in the headline? Instead, it's mentioned once in paragraph four as standard journalistic context - exactly how articles about AWS mention Bezos. And yes, the affected neighborhoods are predominantly Black - that's a factual demographic statement about who bears the health burden, not "playing the race card." Environmental justice reporting routinely documents how industrial pollution disproportionately impacts minority communities. Your logic seems to be: "Musk has done good things for the environment globally, therefore local reporting about his company's regulatory violations must be a hit piece." That's a non sequitur. Both can be true - Tesla can advance EV adoption while xAI can violate air quality regulations in Memphis. One doesn't negate the other. The real tell here is that you're more upset about accurate reporting than about a tech company potentially exposing already-vulnerable communities to additional pollution without proper permits. Your priorities seem to be incredibly misplaced, if you ask me. How's your Tesla Model 3 doing, by the way? Not that I'd want to imply your choice of transportation has anything to do with your incredibly unfavorable interpretation of this article and defense of Musk. But I have to wonder if your perspective would be different if this facility was in your neighborhood rather than South Memphis, or if you drove a Hyundai.
- PhilipRoman 1y ago
  I just realized I don't even know what "disproportionately impacts" actually means. Disproportionate to what? Does it simply mean bigger impact or bigger-than-predicted-by-an-oracle impact? Because I'm quite sure that every bad thing on this planet impacts poor people more.
  - sReinwald 1y ago
    "Disproportionately impacts" means that the burden of pollution isn't randomly distributed - it's systematically concentrated in specific communities. In this case: predominantly Black neighborhoods in South Memphis already have asthma rates and cancer risks 4x the national average (per the article), and xAI added unpermitted turbines to that existing burden. You're absolutely right that most hazards affect poor communities more. That's not a coincidence - it's the predictable result of power dynamics in zoning and enforcement decisions. Your comment reads a bit like "water is wet, why mention it?" But most people living in clean-air zip codes have no idea their comfort of living depends on someone else's respiratory disease. They assume industrial siting is purely based on logistics or economics, not on which communities lack the political capital to fight back. The whole point is that zoning decisions, permit enforcement, and industrial siting aren't random acts of nature. Rich neighborhoods get golf courses and poor neighborhoods get data centers with unpermitted turbines. That's not gravity - it's policy. Documenting these patterns isn't stating the obvious, it's the first step toward accountability. Because "that's just how things are" is exactly what those benefiting from the status quo want everyone to believe.
NilMostChill 1y ago
>I'm no Elon fan, but I can not think of a single human who has done more to reduce dependence on fossil fuels. We could use some of that clean energy he's facilitated to extract a small amount of gold from seawater. Enough to fashion a gold medal we could then award you for first place in olympic level mental gymnastics.
curt15 1y ago
>They claim that the xAI air pollution disproportionately affects black neighbourhoods. Does it? What are the demographics near those turbines?
- rbanffy 1y ago
  Does it really make a difference? Unless, of course, there was a cheaper location near predominantly white neighborhoods.
  - curt15 1y ago
    The OP had an issue with the claim >that the xAI air pollution disproportionately affects black neighbourhoods. So is it true or not? If it true, the outcome is not equitable whether you call it racism or (probably more accurately) classism. It's part of the pernicious pattern among powerful companies of privatizing profits while socialising costs.

DamonHD 1y ago

Many people seem to discount pollution etc that only affects brown-ish people far away that they personally don't know. And guess in which places these kind of stunts are commonly pulled? You wouldn't plonk an illegally fume-belching data centre in a rich white 'hood even if there was plenty of electricity, because political power is the key lever. (I am a 'rich' white western man, FWIW.)

rbanffy 1y ago
You make a great point - pollution sources are often located on cheap land that's occupied, predominantly, by poor people, which, in most of the world, correlates with non-whites. Would something like Flint have happened in Scarsdale or Los Altos? Of course not.
- dotancohen 1y ago
  So this is an economic issue, not a race issue. The two are correlated (everything is correlated to something in a complex system), but to reduce the issue the actual economic factors are to be considered. Not the racial factors. Or would it be fine if xAI were polluting a poor white neighbourhood?
  - DamonHD 1y ago
    We shouldn't be dumping pollution selectively in poor places at all. But it is not coincidence: there is a lot of systematic racism (and other discrimination) in the world and in the US on top of that, that keeps not-white (and not 'Christian', not het, not male, not English-speaking) people not rich. The variables are not independent. Skin colour is prominent in treating some humans as less than human.
    - dotancohen 1y ago
      Well I'm three of your "not"s, my grandfather was a slave, and I still don't see this as a race issue.

amitrip 1y ago

[dead]

richrichardsson 1y ago

> I can not think of a single human who has done more to reduce dependence on fossil fuels I'm struggling to see how it's a single human that is responsible when they just invested in companies?

dotancohen 1y ago
From what I understand that was not only financial investment. Aren't there stories of the guy sleeping on the factory floor trying to diagnose production issues?

sReinwald 1y ago

The article reports that xAI operated gas turbines without required permits and pollution controls for over a year. That's not a "hit piece" - it's documenting regulatory violations with thermal imaging evidence and official permit records. If this were actually a hit piece on Musk, wouldn't his name be in the headline? Instead, it's mentioned once in paragraph four as standard journalistic context - exactly how articles about AWS mention Bezos. And yes, the affected neighborhoods are predominantly Black - that's a factual demographic statement about who bears the health burden, not "playing the race card." Environmental justice reporting routinely documents how industrial pollution disproportionately impacts minority communities. Your logic seems to be: "Musk has done good things for the environment globally, therefore local reporting about his company's regulatory violations must be a hit piece." That's a non sequitur. Both can be true - Tesla can advance EV adoption while xAI can violate air quality regulations in Memphis. One doesn't negate the other. The real tell here is that you're more upset about accurate reporting than about a tech company potentially exposing already-vulnerable communities to additional pollution without proper permits. Your priorities seem to be incredibly misplaced, if you ask me. How's your Tesla Model 3 doing, by the way? Not that I'd want to imply your choice of transportation has anything to do with your incredibly unfavorable interpretation of this article and defense of Musk. But I have to wonder if your perspective would be different if this facility was in your neighborhood rather than South Memphis, or if you drove a Hyundai.

PhilipRoman 1y ago
I just realized I don't even know what "disproportionately impacts" actually means. Disproportionate to what? Does it simply mean bigger impact or bigger-than-predicted-by-an-oracle impact? Because I'm quite sure that every bad thing on this planet impacts poor people more.
- sReinwald 1y ago
  "Disproportionately impacts" means that the burden of pollution isn't randomly distributed - it's systematically concentrated in specific communities. In this case: predominantly Black neighborhoods in South Memphis already have asthma rates and cancer risks 4x the national average (per the article), and xAI added unpermitted turbines to that existing burden. You're absolutely right that most hazards affect poor communities more. That's not a coincidence - it's the predictable result of power dynamics in zoning and enforcement decisions. Your comment reads a bit like "water is wet, why mention it?" But most people living in clean-air zip codes have no idea their comfort of living depends on someone else's respiratory disease. They assume industrial siting is purely based on logistics or economics, not on which communities lack the political capital to fight back. The whole point is that zoning decisions, permit enforcement, and industrial siting aren't random acts of nature. Rich neighborhoods get golf courses and poor neighborhoods get data centers with unpermitted turbines. That's not gravity - it's policy. Documenting these patterns isn't stating the obvious, it's the first step toward accountability. Because "that's just how things are" is exactly what those benefiting from the status quo want everyone to believe.

NilMostChill 1y ago

>I'm no Elon fan, but I can not think of a single human who has done more to reduce dependence on fossil fuels. We could use some of that clean energy he's facilitated to extract a small amount of gold from seawater. Enough to fashion a gold medal we could then award you for first place in olympic level mental gymnastics.

curt15 1y ago

>They claim that the xAI air pollution disproportionately affects black neighbourhoods. Does it? What are the demographics near those turbines?

rbanffy 1y ago
Does it really make a difference? Unless, of course, there was a cheaper location near predominantly white neighborhoods.
- curt15 1y ago
  The OP had an issue with the claim >that the xAI air pollution disproportionately affects black neighbourhoods. So is it true or not? If it true, the outcome is not equitable whether you call it racism or (probably more accurately) classism. It's part of the pernicious pattern among powerful companies of privatizing profits while socialising costs.