4 ms·

The game that kicked this particular petition off was The Crew, a game that you could happily play single player which Ubisoft made always online purely for DRM

The game that kicked this particular petition off was The Crew, a game that you could happily play single player which Ubisoft made always online purely for DRM reasons its a prime example of the abuse of power that legislators should be doing something ab0out.

robertlagrant 1y ago
This isn't exactly an abuse of power - you can just not buy it. UbiSoft has transformed itself into a terrible, bloated company and it probably die soon, but the better way to do this is to have industry standards similar to PEGI that describe the game's future support, not to hit them with EU-specific regulations.
- blargey 1y ago
  "Let the problem fester until the negative externalities build up so much it overcomes the coordination problem and companies are subject to the same coercion (but through 'market forces' so it's good), one day, eventually, maybe" isn't a meaningful argument against legislation.
  - soulofmischief 1y ago
    Excellent summary of our current pseudocapitalist hellscape. How do we stop this ride when even the meta is a coordination problem.
    - redeeman 1y ago
      and yet it would be solved overnight if the consumers just stopped buying what they evidently dislike so much
      - badsectoracula 1y ago
        The problem is that these consumers realize they'd dislike some things of a product long after buying it (and often it isn't the entire product that is a problem, so someone might still dislike a lot some aspect of a product while liking another aspect of it). And others may not even realize the negative issues at all but still they create network effects that drag other consumers along the ride anyway, regardless of if they like it or not.
- m463 1y ago
  Arguments like this are not very powerful. It seems like "abstinence is a birth control method" that said, more occurrences of this situation might make your argument more powerful over time.
  - pjerem 1y ago
    That’s the American/capitalist thinking : the market should sort itself out against bad actors.
    - wkat4242 1y ago
      Yeah and it doesn't work because the market isn't really free. Becoming a AAA game publisher requires so much money that has so many strings attached that there is no concept of a real free market. Personally I don't believe a real free market can exist anyway. There always has to be a balance between socialism and capitalism. All the big publishers are bound by these strings such as the wish for more recurring revenue. Hence the microtransactions and online models. You can't really avoid those.
      - pjerem 1y ago
        > Personally I don't believe a real free market can exist anyway. There always has to be a balance between socialism and capitalism. I 100% share this but I can’t understand how even the most capitalist (ideologically) person in the world would not want to create rules to at least avoid actors to become too big. Monopolies are a bug of the capitalism and they break it from the inside. When monopolies aren’t kept at bay, you aren’t even in capitalism anymore.
        robertlagrant 1y ago
        > I 100% share this but I can’t understand how even the most capitalist (ideologically) person in the world would not want to create rules to at least avoid actors to become too big. This is definitely true. I don't know if this is true, but my instinct is that it's much harder to create a monopoly if you don't have a government willing to write rules to enforce your existing advantages.
- Hamuko 1y ago
  >you can just not buy it Did Ubisoft clearly advertise the fact that the game would stop functioning entirely in the future when it was selling it?
  - robertlagrant 1y ago
    Hence: > the better way to do this is to have industry standards similar to PEGI that describe the game's future support, not to hit them with EU-specific regulations.
    - antonkochubey 1y ago
      Coincidentally EU regulations are quite good at creating new industry standards
- wkat4242 1y ago
  > This isn't exactly an abuse of power - you can just not buy it. This is the EU. We don't believe the market fixes everything. As an EU citizen I really applaud the restrictions on bad business practices of tech companies. A lot of those are US-based but they'll have to play by our rules if they want to operate here.

robertlagrant 1y ago

This isn't exactly an abuse of power - you can just not buy it. UbiSoft has transformed itself into a terrible, bloated company and it probably die soon, but the better way to do this is to have industry standards similar to PEGI that describe the game's future support, not to hit them with EU-specific regulations.

blargey 1y ago
"Let the problem fester until the negative externalities build up so much it overcomes the coordination problem and companies are subject to the same coercion (but through 'market forces' so it's good), one day, eventually, maybe" isn't a meaningful argument against legislation.
- soulofmischief 1y ago
  Excellent summary of our current pseudocapitalist hellscape. How do we stop this ride when even the meta is a coordination problem.
  - redeeman 1y ago
    and yet it would be solved overnight if the consumers just stopped buying what they evidently dislike so much
    - badsectoracula 1y ago
      The problem is that these consumers realize they'd dislike some things of a product long after buying it (and often it isn't the entire product that is a problem, so someone might still dislike a lot some aspect of a product while liking another aspect of it). And others may not even realize the negative issues at all but still they create network effects that drag other consumers along the ride anyway, regardless of if they like it or not.
m463 1y ago
Arguments like this are not very powerful. It seems like "abstinence is a birth control method" that said, more occurrences of this situation might make your argument more powerful over time.
- pjerem 1y ago
  That’s the American/capitalist thinking : the market should sort itself out against bad actors.
  - wkat4242 1y ago
    Yeah and it doesn't work because the market isn't really free. Becoming a AAA game publisher requires so much money that has so many strings attached that there is no concept of a real free market. Personally I don't believe a real free market can exist anyway. There always has to be a balance between socialism and capitalism. All the big publishers are bound by these strings such as the wish for more recurring revenue. Hence the microtransactions and online models. You can't really avoid those.
    - pjerem 1y ago
      > Personally I don't believe a real free market can exist anyway. There always has to be a balance between socialism and capitalism. I 100% share this but I can’t understand how even the most capitalist (ideologically) person in the world would not want to create rules to at least avoid actors to become too big. Monopolies are a bug of the capitalism and they break it from the inside. When monopolies aren’t kept at bay, you aren’t even in capitalism anymore.
      - robertlagrant 1y ago
        > I 100% share this but I can’t understand how even the most capitalist (ideologically) person in the world would not want to create rules to at least avoid actors to become too big. This is definitely true. I don't know if this is true, but my instinct is that it's much harder to create a monopoly if you don't have a government willing to write rules to enforce your existing advantages.
Hamuko 1y ago
>you can just not buy it Did Ubisoft clearly advertise the fact that the game would stop functioning entirely in the future when it was selling it?
- robertlagrant 1y ago
  Hence: > the better way to do this is to have industry standards similar to PEGI that describe the game's future support, not to hit them with EU-specific regulations.
  - antonkochubey 1y ago
    Coincidentally EU regulations are quite good at creating new industry standards
wkat4242 1y ago
> This isn't exactly an abuse of power - you can just not buy it. This is the EU. We don't believe the market fixes everything. As an EU citizen I really applaud the restrictions on bad business practices of tech companies. A lot of those are US-based but they'll have to play by our rules if they want to operate here.