4 ms·

Appointing a know-nothing conspiracy theorist doesn't have that exact issue, yes … but in a way where the cure is significantly worse than the disease. You can

Appointing a know-nothing conspiracy theorist doesn't have that exact issue, yes … but in a way where the cure is significantly worse than the disease. You can cultivate state capacity and independent expertise to reduce regulatory capture, not replace it with a kakistocracy where regulatory capture is instead by woo-woo morons.

tombert 1y ago
While I would agree with your overall synopsis, RFK Jr. actually has some conflicts of interest with regards to the anti-vax stuff. He directly profits from anti-vax lawsuits, and if he's in charge of the CDC and FDA he has the motivation to try and publish fake reports from (previously) respected departments. https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2025/01/22/nx-s1-5271582/rfk-hpv-vaccine-merck https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2025/01/22/nx...
ekianjo 1y ago
> but in a way where the cure is significantly worse than the disease. Since the US has by far the sickest human population on Earth (it's not even debatable), I guess the current system has been a spectacular failure. I don't think that RFK is the right answer either, but "continuing on the same path as before" is a bad idea just as well. > independent expertise to reduce regulatory capture What is independent expertise exactly? Where do you find virgin experts completely devoid of external influence? I have yet to meet any expert who has never had grants or speaker engagements.
- sjsdaiuasgdia 1y ago
  So instead we should listen to the "health influencers" that surround people like RFK Jr? Are they independent?
  - ekianjo 1y ago
    I'm not giving you a solution, I am simply observing that the current system is utterly broken. So continuing as is is not an option, obviously.
    - sjsdaiuasgdia 1y ago
      You're throwing out the baby with the bathwater, and handing control to insane people in the process.
      - ekianjo 1y ago
        I did not appoint RFK. So what's your solution, by the way?
- tombert 1y ago
  > Since the US has by far the sickest human population on Earth (it's not even debatable) I am having trouble finding evidence for this claim that you said is “not debatable”. I found some articles that the US is the sickest in the developed world, but that’s pretty different than “sickest human population on earth”.
- ben_w 1y ago
  > Since the US has by far the sickest human population on Earth (it's not even debatable), I guess the current system has been a spectacular failure I suspect everyone affected by the sub-Saharan AIDS epidemic would disagree very strongly, even despite the improvements over the last 20 years. More generally, the US may be an outlier among industrialised nations, but the floor for health in general is much lower than the USA. This also means you have a long way further to fall if you allow incompetent leadership.
  - ekianjo 1y ago
    I don't think you will find any other country where the obesity rate and diabetes rate is as high as in the US.
    - ben_w 1y ago
      USA is 13th for obesity rate according to the WHO in 2022, with Egypt at rank 12, Qatar at 11, and Kuwait at 10: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_r... If you focus on obesity-related deaths, the USA is even further down the charts, as somehow even Palestine (albeit in 2021, but still) manages to get a higher percentage of those than the USA: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/share-of-deaths-obesity?tab=chart&country=COK~FJI~ASM~SAU~QAT~NRU~TON~MHL~WSM~KWT~NIU~FSM~BHR~KIR~ARE~EGY~SYR~TUV~PLW~PSE~JOR~PRI~TKL~DMA~MUS~MNP~OMN~LBY~ATG~IRQ~USA https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/share-of-deaths-obesity?t... For diabetes rates, the USA (10.7%) isn't just lower than Egypt (20.9%), but also is also lower than Mexico (16.9%), and far short of the worst, which is Pakistan (30.8%): https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/diabetes-prevalence?tab=chart&country=USA~ZAF~AFG~MEX~PAK~PYF~KWT~NRU~NCL~MNP~MHL~MUS~KIR~EGY~TUV~ASM~SLB~QAT~GUM~MYS~SDN~SAU~FJI~PLW~PNG~ARE~KNA~FSM~VUT~JOR~TON~SYR~BLZ~TUR~BGD~BRB~OMN~PRI~GTM~BMU~CYM~TTO~SUR~GRD~TZA~ZMB~LKA~JAM~BRN~BHR~SGP~CUW~LCA~GUY~DMA~COM~ATG~VIR~CHL&mapSelect=USA~ZAF~AFG~MEX~PAK https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/diabetes-prevalence?tab=c... Each of Egypt, Qatar, and Kuwait are worse than the USA on both measures simultaneously.

tombert 1y ago

While I would agree with your overall synopsis, RFK Jr. actually has some conflicts of interest with regards to the anti-vax stuff. He directly profits from anti-vax lawsuits, and if he's in charge of the CDC and FDA he has the motivation to try and publish fake reports from (previously) respected departments. https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2025/01/22/nx-s1-5271582/rfk-hpv-vaccine-merck https://www.npr.org/sections/shots-health-news/2025/01/22/nx...

ekianjo 1y ago

> but in a way where the cure is significantly worse than the disease. Since the US has by far the sickest human population on Earth (it's not even debatable), I guess the current system has been a spectacular failure. I don't think that RFK is the right answer either, but "continuing on the same path as before" is a bad idea just as well. > independent expertise to reduce regulatory capture What is independent expertise exactly? Where do you find virgin experts completely devoid of external influence? I have yet to meet any expert who has never had grants or speaker engagements.

sjsdaiuasgdia 1y ago
So instead we should listen to the "health influencers" that surround people like RFK Jr? Are they independent?
- ekianjo 1y ago
  I'm not giving you a solution, I am simply observing that the current system is utterly broken. So continuing as is is not an option, obviously.
  - sjsdaiuasgdia 1y ago
    You're throwing out the baby with the bathwater, and handing control to insane people in the process.
    - ekianjo 1y ago
      I did not appoint RFK. So what's your solution, by the way?
tombert 1y ago
> Since the US has by far the sickest human population on Earth (it's not even debatable) I am having trouble finding evidence for this claim that you said is “not debatable”. I found some articles that the US is the sickest in the developed world, but that’s pretty different than “sickest human population on earth”.
ben_w 1y ago
> Since the US has by far the sickest human population on Earth (it's not even debatable), I guess the current system has been a spectacular failure I suspect everyone affected by the sub-Saharan AIDS epidemic would disagree very strongly, even despite the improvements over the last 20 years. More generally, the US may be an outlier among industrialised nations, but the floor for health in general is much lower than the USA. This also means you have a long way further to fall if you allow incompetent leadership.
- ekianjo 1y ago
  I don't think you will find any other country where the obesity rate and diabetes rate is as high as in the US.
  - ben_w 1y ago
    USA is 13th for obesity rate according to the WHO in 2022, with Egypt at rank 12, Qatar at 11, and Kuwait at 10: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_rate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_obesity_r... If you focus on obesity-related deaths, the USA is even further down the charts, as somehow even Palestine (albeit in 2021, but still) manages to get a higher percentage of those than the USA: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/share-of-deaths-obesity?tab=chart&country=COK~FJI~ASM~SAU~QAT~NRU~TON~MHL~WSM~KWT~NIU~FSM~BHR~KIR~ARE~EGY~SYR~TUV~PLW~PSE~JOR~PRI~TKL~DMA~MUS~MNP~OMN~LBY~ATG~IRQ~USA https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/share-of-deaths-obesity?t... For diabetes rates, the USA (10.7%) isn't just lower than Egypt (20.9%), but also is also lower than Mexico (16.9%), and far short of the worst, which is Pakistan (30.8%): https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/diabetes-prevalence?tab=chart&country=USA~ZAF~AFG~MEX~PAK~PYF~KWT~NRU~NCL~MNP~MHL~MUS~KIR~EGY~TUV~ASM~SLB~QAT~GUM~MYS~SDN~SAU~FJI~PLW~PNG~ARE~KNA~FSM~VUT~JOR~TON~SYR~BLZ~TUR~BGD~BRB~OMN~PRI~GTM~BMU~CYM~TTO~SUR~GRD~TZA~ZMB~LKA~JAM~BRN~BHR~SGP~CUW~LCA~GUY~DMA~COM~ATG~VIR~CHL&mapSelect=USA~ZAF~AFG~MEX~PAK https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/diabetes-prevalence?tab=c... Each of Egypt, Qatar, and Kuwait are worse than the USA on both measures simultaneously.