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"It's crypto all over again" Crypto is a lifeline for me, as I cannot open a bank account in the country I live in, for reasons I can neither control nor fix.

"It's crypto all over again" Crypto is a lifeline for me, as I cannot open a bank account in the country I live in, for reasons I can neither control nor fix. So I am happy if crypto is useless for you. For me and for millions like me, it is a matter of life and death. As for LLMs — once again, magic for some, reliable deterministic instrument for others (and also magic). Just classified and sorted a few hundreds of invoices. Yes, magic.

harel 1y ago
Can you elaborate on your situation? Which country are you in? How is crypto used there?
- atemerev 1y ago
  I am a Russian immigrant in Switzerland. As of right now, all Swiss banks block all Russian bank accounts until their owners can provide a valid physical residence permit card, due to sweeping sanctions (meanwhile, Russian-owned companies continue to freely trade crude oil from here, as they use Swiss nominal directors — the hypocrisy is through the roof). My residence permit is on renewal now and the case is being dragged for 7 months already — so, no bank account.
  - harel 1y ago
    Thank you for indulging my curiosity. I really hope your (and our world's) situation improves soon.
  - assuagering 1y ago
    Are you paid for work and able to pay for rent and groceries with cryptocurrency?
    - atemerev 1y ago
      Yes, I am paid for work in crypto (I am a consultant), and I can exchange it for cash and pay for rent and groceries in cash, just like people did in the previous century. In some other Swiss cantons like Zug, you can pay some of the bills and even some taxes with crypto directly, but not here yet.
mumbisChungo 1y ago
Said this in another thread and I'll repeat it here: It's the same problem that crypto experiences. Almost everyone is propagating lies about the technology, even if a majority of those doing so don't understand enough to realize they're lies (naivety vs malice). I'd argue there's more intentional lying in crypto and less value to be gained, but in both cases people who might derive real benefit from the hard truth of the matter are turning away before they enter the door due to dishonesty/misrepresentation- and in both cases there are examples of people deriving real value today.
- o11c 1y ago
  > I'd argue there's more intentional lying in crypto I disagree. Crypto sounds more like intentional lying because it's primarily hyped in contexts typical for scams/gambling. Yes, there are businesses involved (anybody can start one), but they're mostly new businesses or a tiny tack-on to an existing business. AI is largely being hyped within the existing major corporate structures, therefore its lies just get tagged as as "business as usual". That doesn't make them any less of a lie though.
  - mumbisChungo 1y ago
    I think crypto companies and AI companies probably intentionally mislead approximately the same amount as one another, but in crypto the average participant is often bagholding a very short term investment and has a direct and tangible incentive to mislead as many people about it as quickly as possible- whereas in AI people mostly just get lost in the sauce with anthropomorphism. Anecdotally, I see a lot more bold-facing lies by crypto traders or NFT "collectors" than by LLM enthusiasts.
tehjoker 1y ago
This is basically the only use case for crypto, and one for which it was explicitly designed: censorship resistance. This is why people have so much trouble finding useful things for it to do in the legal economy, it was explicitly designed to facilitate transactions the government doesn't want or can't facilitate. In some cases, there are humanitarian applications, there are also a lot of illicit applications.
foobarchu 1y ago
I don't think you actually disagree with the authors quip. You seem to want to use crypto as a currency, while OP was most likely referring to the grifting around crypto as an investment. If you're using it as a currency, then the people trying to pump and dump coins and use it for a money making vehicle are your adversaries. You are best served if it's stable instead of a rollercoaster of booms and busts.
- atemerev 1y ago
  Stablecoins are a thing. But yes, I hate the current state of affairs, with "memecoins" and whatsnot. Particularly the government push from one particular country. We created crypto to be independent from governments, not to enable them.
troupo 1y ago
It's a valid use case in the sea of nonsensical hype where "you are a moron if you don't believe in some true meaning of crypto". "You had to be there to believe it" https://x.com/0xbags/status/1940774543553146956 https://x.com/0xbags/status/1940774543553146956 AI craze is currently going through a similar period: any criticism is brushed away as being presented by morons who know nothing

harel 1y ago

Can you elaborate on your situation? Which country are you in? How is crypto used there?

atemerev 1y ago
I am a Russian immigrant in Switzerland. As of right now, all Swiss banks block all Russian bank accounts until their owners can provide a valid physical residence permit card, due to sweeping sanctions (meanwhile, Russian-owned companies continue to freely trade crude oil from here, as they use Swiss nominal directors — the hypocrisy is through the roof). My residence permit is on renewal now and the case is being dragged for 7 months already — so, no bank account.
- harel 1y ago
  Thank you for indulging my curiosity. I really hope your (and our world's) situation improves soon.
- assuagering 1y ago
  Are you paid for work and able to pay for rent and groceries with cryptocurrency?
  - atemerev 1y ago
    Yes, I am paid for work in crypto (I am a consultant), and I can exchange it for cash and pay for rent and groceries in cash, just like people did in the previous century. In some other Swiss cantons like Zug, you can pay some of the bills and even some taxes with crypto directly, but not here yet.

mumbisChungo 1y ago

Said this in another thread and I'll repeat it here: It's the same problem that crypto experiences. Almost everyone is propagating lies about the technology, even if a majority of those doing so don't understand enough to realize they're lies (naivety vs malice). I'd argue there's more intentional lying in crypto and less value to be gained, but in both cases people who might derive real benefit from the hard truth of the matter are turning away before they enter the door due to dishonesty/misrepresentation- and in both cases there are examples of people deriving real value today.

o11c 1y ago
> I'd argue there's more intentional lying in crypto I disagree. Crypto sounds more like intentional lying because it's primarily hyped in contexts typical for scams/gambling. Yes, there are businesses involved (anybody can start one), but they're mostly new businesses or a tiny tack-on to an existing business. AI is largely being hyped within the existing major corporate structures, therefore its lies just get tagged as as "business as usual". That doesn't make them any less of a lie though.
- mumbisChungo 1y ago
  I think crypto companies and AI companies probably intentionally mislead approximately the same amount as one another, but in crypto the average participant is often bagholding a very short term investment and has a direct and tangible incentive to mislead as many people about it as quickly as possible- whereas in AI people mostly just get lost in the sauce with anthropomorphism. Anecdotally, I see a lot more bold-facing lies by crypto traders or NFT "collectors" than by LLM enthusiasts.

tehjoker 1y ago

This is basically the only use case for crypto, and one for which it was explicitly designed: censorship resistance. This is why people have so much trouble finding useful things for it to do in the legal economy, it was explicitly designed to facilitate transactions the government doesn't want or can't facilitate. In some cases, there are humanitarian applications, there are also a lot of illicit applications.

foobarchu 1y ago

I don't think you actually disagree with the authors quip. You seem to want to use crypto as a currency, while OP was most likely referring to the grifting around crypto as an investment. If you're using it as a currency, then the people trying to pump and dump coins and use it for a money making vehicle are your adversaries. You are best served if it's stable instead of a rollercoaster of booms and busts.

atemerev 1y ago
Stablecoins are a thing. But yes, I hate the current state of affairs, with "memecoins" and whatsnot. Particularly the government push from one particular country. We created crypto to be independent from governments, not to enable them.

troupo 1y ago

It's a valid use case in the sea of nonsensical hype where "you are a moron if you don't believe in some true meaning of crypto". "You had to be there to believe it" https://x.com/0xbags/status/1940774543553146956 https://x.com/0xbags/status/1940774543553146956 AI craze is currently going through a similar period: any criticism is brushed away as being presented by morons who know nothing