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Are people deploying production code in a language that is still in its 0.x version?

by Hamuko 1y ago

zwnow 1y ago
I dont but there are companies who trust the language (which is a good thing but also short sighted)
cenamus 1y ago
I mean, what's the difference to the python 2/3 debacle? People were writing/extending in python 2 long after it was declared obsolete
- Hamuko 1y ago
  Not having breaking changes every N months?
  - flohofwoe 1y ago
    Each new minor Python 3.x version has plenty of deprecations followed by removals in the stdlib though.
    - Hamuko 1y ago
      I don't think even those are particularly short periods. TestCase.assertEquals() was deprecated in Python 3.2 (February 2011) and removed in Python 3.12 (October 2023). 12 ⅔ years to get rid of a silly alias because it's a breaking change (of a single character).
- mirashii 1y ago
  It's not about sticking around on an old version, it's about ever being able to catch up, and what the rest of the ecosystem is going to do. Python did this major version bump that broke a lot of the ecosystem, and it went so poorly that they've effectively promised never to do it again and completely excised any thought of ever having a major version bump again, and other languages and communities now point to it regularly as a debacle to be avoided. When you break things regularly, you're forcing a choice on every individual package in the ecosystem: move forward, and leave the old users behind, or stay behind, and risk that the rest of the ecosystem moves forward without you. Now you've got a whole ecosystem in a prisoner's dilemma. For an individual, maybe you can make a choice and dig in and make your way along without too much trouble. But the ecosystem as a whole can't, the ecosystem fractures, and if it doesn't converge on the latest version, it slowly withers and dies.
- skybrian 1y ago
  Static types help to find what needs to be fixed. Something like 'go fix' would be useful for fixing them. Apparently something like that is being considered for zig.
ozgrakkurt 1y ago
A lot of people were using tokio in prod when it was 0.1 and didn’t get upset afaik. Rust didn’t even have async await at that time
- bogdan 1y ago
  Some prod are more prod than the others.
- Ygg2 1y ago
  > A lot of people were using tokio in prod when it was 0.1 and didn’t get upset afaik. Citation needed. A lot of people wanted Rust to stabilize. Hence why they huried to Rust 1.0.

Are people deploying production code in a language that is still in its 0.x version?

by Hamuko 1y ago

Are people deploying production code in a language that is still in its 0.x version?

zwnow 1y ago

I dont but there are companies who trust the language (which is a good thing but also short sighted)

cenamus 1y ago

I mean, what's the difference to the python 2/3 debacle? People were writing/extending in python 2 long after it was declared obsolete

Hamuko 1y ago
Not having breaking changes every N months?
- flohofwoe 1y ago
  Each new minor Python 3.x version has plenty of deprecations followed by removals in the stdlib though.
  - Hamuko 1y ago
    I don't think even those are particularly short periods. TestCase.assertEquals() was deprecated in Python 3.2 (February 2011) and removed in Python 3.12 (October 2023). 12 ⅔ years to get rid of a silly alias because it's a breaking change (of a single character).
mirashii 1y ago
It's not about sticking around on an old version, it's about ever being able to catch up, and what the rest of the ecosystem is going to do. Python did this major version bump that broke a lot of the ecosystem, and it went so poorly that they've effectively promised never to do it again and completely excised any thought of ever having a major version bump again, and other languages and communities now point to it regularly as a debacle to be avoided. When you break things regularly, you're forcing a choice on every individual package in the ecosystem: move forward, and leave the old users behind, or stay behind, and risk that the rest of the ecosystem moves forward without you. Now you've got a whole ecosystem in a prisoner's dilemma. For an individual, maybe you can make a choice and dig in and make your way along without too much trouble. But the ecosystem as a whole can't, the ecosystem fractures, and if it doesn't converge on the latest version, it slowly withers and dies.
skybrian 1y ago
Static types help to find what needs to be fixed. Something like 'go fix' would be useful for fixing them. Apparently something like that is being considered for zig.

ozgrakkurt 1y ago

A lot of people were using tokio in prod when it was 0.1 and didn’t get upset afaik. Rust didn’t even have async await at that time

bogdan 1y ago
Some prod are more prod than the others.
Ygg2 1y ago
> A lot of people were using tokio in prod when it was 0.1 and didn’t get upset afaik. Citation needed. A lot of people wanted Rust to stabilize. Hence why they huried to Rust 1.0.