8 ms·

We could install HVAC in each hive. Can heat pumps be scaled down to that size?

by tantalor 1y ago

newsclues 1y ago
there are simple, no power, designs that have existed for a long time that would be a better way to go. kiss
- aspenmayer 1y ago
  I'm thinking something like a wind-powered rotating attic fan.
  - newsclues 1y ago
    No power and no moving parts are good design goals. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windcatcher https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windcatcher Perforated Double Skinned Exterior Lots of cool tech from the past
    - aspenmayer 1y ago
      Sometimes the old ways are best. To paraphrase Jerry Seinfeld, sometimes the road less traveled is less traveled for a reason, or they'd just call it the way. Who benefits most from old methods and tech remaining a historical footnote, but the very people selling their new whiz-bang solutions for modern problems, which are themselves inherent to using their products and energy production and consumption supply chain?
colanderman 1y ago
Peltier heat pumps, though less efficient than other types, can be made very small and have no moving parts.
- joshstrange 1y ago
  > though less efficient than other types IIRC they are _massively_ less efficient. Relevant Technology Connections video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnMRePtHMZY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnMRePtHMZY
cogman10 1y ago
You don't typically have just 1 hive. It's usually a group of them. You wouldn't need an HVAC per hive, but rather 1 HVAC for the swarm. Get a water mass, HVAC it to the right temperature, and then pump the water through the hives to maintain a good temp. It'd be somewhat more expensive and you'd have to have enough insulation to make sure the water isn't prematurely cooling before reaching the hive. Hives also tend to be really cheap. They are simply wood boxes. So you'd be competing with $100 wood box with $200 wood box and $1000 HVAC and plumbing.
waffletower 1y ago
There may be passive geothermal heat pump architectures that would be a good fit. Surprised that you can still learn about geothermal heat pumps from the U.S. government: https://www.energy.gov/eere/geothermal/geothermal-heat-pumps https://www.energy.gov/eere/geothermal/geothermal-heat-pumps
- ted_dunning 1y ago
  Commercial hives need to be portable. Geothermal isn't that.

We could install HVAC in each hive. Can heat pumps be scaled down to that size?

newsclues 1y ago

there are simple, no power, designs that have existed for a long time that would be a better way to go. kiss

aspenmayer 1y ago
I'm thinking something like a wind-powered rotating attic fan.
- newsclues 1y ago
  No power and no moving parts are good design goals. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windcatcher https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windcatcher Perforated Double Skinned Exterior Lots of cool tech from the past
  - aspenmayer 1y ago
    Sometimes the old ways are best. To paraphrase Jerry Seinfeld, sometimes the road less traveled is less traveled for a reason, or they'd just call it the way. Who benefits most from old methods and tech remaining a historical footnote, but the very people selling their new whiz-bang solutions for modern problems, which are themselves inherent to using their products and energy production and consumption supply chain?

colanderman 1y ago

Peltier heat pumps, though less efficient than other types, can be made very small and have no moving parts.

joshstrange 1y ago
> though less efficient than other types IIRC they are _massively_ less efficient. Relevant Technology Connections video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnMRePtHMZY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CnMRePtHMZY

cogman10 1y ago

You don't typically have just 1 hive. It's usually a group of them. You wouldn't need an HVAC per hive, but rather 1 HVAC for the swarm. Get a water mass, HVAC it to the right temperature, and then pump the water through the hives to maintain a good temp. It'd be somewhat more expensive and you'd have to have enough insulation to make sure the water isn't prematurely cooling before reaching the hive. Hives also tend to be really cheap. They are simply wood boxes. So you'd be competing with $100 wood box with $200 wood box and $1000 HVAC and plumbing.

waffletower 1y ago

There may be passive geothermal heat pump architectures that would be a good fit. Surprised that you can still learn about geothermal heat pumps from the U.S. government: https://www.energy.gov/eere/geothermal/geothermal-heat-pumps https://www.energy.gov/eere/geothermal/geothermal-heat-pumps

ted_dunning 1y ago
Commercial hives need to be portable. Geothermal isn't that.