4 ms·

This could get dicey. I know there are a lot of users out there and I understand the various causes for use. However, for those of us who didn't because of conc

This could get dicey. I know there are a lot of users out there and I understand the various causes for use. However, for those of us who didn't because of concerns like this, it is a bit vindicating. Addiction is a disease, full sympathy, but please get help if you need it.

cluckindan 1y ago
Are all cannabis users addicts?
- owebmaster 1y ago
  I don't think so, I smoke for the past 20 years and I'm not addicted /s
- SkyeCA 1y ago
  According to a lot of people online? Yes, and they're the same type who will tell you an occasional glass of wine with a meal makes you an alcoholic.
- chisleu 1y ago
  Speaking as an addict, yes most regular users are. It's not the same kind of addiction (emotional, not physical) but it's still addictive. If you smoke weed every day for a year, and stop, for the first year you stop, your suicide rate is doubled.
  - code_for_monkey 1y ago
    Isnt it possible that people smoking weed were treating conditions like anxiety or depression and are more likely to commit suicide in the first place? Weed has had a real deficit of actual study and although some people can get a dependency on it I have a hard time qualifying those people as addicts when stopping weed is so much less dangerous and difficult than other substances. Its a complicated topic that requires quite a lot of care when you talk about it, because labelling someone as an addict is a tall order and also weed has been a moral panic for so long.
    - chisleu 1y ago
      Oh that’s absolutely part of it.
      - cluckindan 1y ago
        Is it not a bit disingenuous to imply that cannabis causes the suicidality if it is actually the cessation of (self-)treatment that causes it?
        chisleu 1y ago
        I don't know brother. I'm not making that claim. I'm repeating it.
        cluckindan 1y ago
        That’s generally how misinformation propagates. Hearsay.
        chisleu 1y ago
        Yeah except it's not hearsay so much as repeating a credible source.
  - _Algernon_ 1y ago
    Citation needed
    - chisleu 1y ago
      Heard it from the doctor on mtv. Remember that show?
      - _Algernon_ 1y ago
        No
        chisleu 1y ago
        Dr Drew and Adam Corola had a show on MTV where they discussed it at length.
        cluckindan 1y ago
        LoveLine? ”Carolla co-hosted the syndicated radio call-in program Loveline with Drew Pinsky from 1995 to 2005 as well as the show's television incarnation on MTV from 1996 to 2000.” Pinsky is seemingly a medical doctor specializing in addiction treatment. Just saying that he has a financial incentive to present hyperbole, not to mention a dramatic one (anything for more content in his rehab TV shows)
  - haswell 1y ago
    People don’t take the withdrawal potential seriously. I’ve had a complex relationship with cannabis over the years, and one of the things that I didn’t understand before getting stuck in a daily habit of heavy use for a period of time is how hard it can be on your body to just stop. I had major upset stomach and food aversion for a few weeks to the point that I lost 10 pounds, major sleep issues, a major spike in depressive symptoms (not just baseline depression, because I eventually got back to baseline), etc.
    - chisleu 1y ago
      Same. After enough use, I just kind of forgot how to have fun without it. Sleep issues are the worst.
    - cluckindan 1y ago
      Anecdotes are not helpful here. Did you commonly have an upset stomach and food aversion before?
      - haswell 1y ago
        No, upset stomach and food aversion were not common for me before. I've gone through the quitting process several times over the years, and the experience was consistent each time. I've also run experiments while quitting like: what happens to the food aversion and stomach issues if I use some cannabis? When in the middle of withdrawal, it was like flipping a switch that allowed me to eat again. These symptoms are well known among the cannabis community, and there is increasing awareness in the medical community [0] especially for people who experience the most extreme forms like CHS [1], which has become increasingly common with more people using extremely high % THC products. If you're curious about this subject, I'd highly recommend reading the thousands of 1st hand accounts of the quitting process on a subreddit like /r/petioles or /r/leaves. It's extremely common for people to be skeptical of cannabis addiction/withdrawal [2], and I'm pretty certain this is an overcorrection after the decades of demonization and straight-up lies about cannabis. This is understandable, but the pendulum is gradually swinging back as more people experience difficulties quitting. I'm still in favor of legal cannabis, but the addiction potential is very real and worth highlighting. Part of the issue currently is that research is decades behind at this point due to the federal scheduling of the drug, and much of the research we do have was conducted with old low-THC strains. Hopefully we'll get better studies that highlight the things many heavy users already know 1st hand. - [0] https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9110555/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9110555/ - [1] https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/21665-cannabis-hyperemesis-syndrome https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/21665-cannabi... - [2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2023/07/31/marijuana-addiction-legal-recreational-sales/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2023/07/31/marijuana-a...
  - cluckindan 1y ago
    That effect could be simply due to pre-existing pathology such as anxiety, depression or even PTSD, not necessarily due to cannabis. Do you have a source for those statistics?
owebmaster 1y ago
Some of us are smoking for the past 20, 30, 40 years without cardiovascular issues tho. And I have met many old guys and ladies smoking weed in their 60, 70s doing fine if not better than their peers.
- Popeyes 1y ago
  You can only meet the ones who haven't died.
- 0xbadcafebee 1y ago
  There are many old guys who smoke a pack of cigarettes a day for their whole life. There's many more guys who aren't as old because they died from smoking a pack of cigarettes a day. (I'm not saying weed causes these issues, but I am saying anecdotes are less than useful)
  - owebmaster 1y ago
    I have met many smokers with diseases directly related to the habit of smoking cigarettes. I have never met a cannabis smoker in the same situation or that developed it over time (20 years span). Obviously, cannabis smokers also die from heart diseases but if smoking cannabis was something that would be related to heart attacks we would know by now, a research would not be needed or it would be quite obvious and accepted.
    - bluGill 1y ago
      Cannabis was illegal for many years in most countries (it often still is, but the laws are ignored). There have not been many studies year, given the timelines of the law enforcement I'd expect that we would first see the long term studies start to come out now. And of course the first studies will not be conclusive.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
harimau777 1y ago
I think that a lot of drug users (at least in America) use drugs to escape their circumstances. IMHO, what's needed is to help people improve their circumstances so that they have better alternatives. Unfortunately, that is sorely lacking in America.

cluckindan 1y ago

Are all cannabis users addicts?

owebmaster 1y ago
I don't think so, I smoke for the past 20 years and I'm not addicted /s
SkyeCA 1y ago
According to a lot of people online? Yes, and they're the same type who will tell you an occasional glass of wine with a meal makes you an alcoholic.
chisleu 1y ago
Speaking as an addict, yes most regular users are. It's not the same kind of addiction (emotional, not physical) but it's still addictive. If you smoke weed every day for a year, and stop, for the first year you stop, your suicide rate is doubled.
- code_for_monkey 1y ago
  Isnt it possible that people smoking weed were treating conditions like anxiety or depression and are more likely to commit suicide in the first place? Weed has had a real deficit of actual study and although some people can get a dependency on it I have a hard time qualifying those people as addicts when stopping weed is so much less dangerous and difficult than other substances. Its a complicated topic that requires quite a lot of care when you talk about it, because labelling someone as an addict is a tall order and also weed has been a moral panic for so long.
  - chisleu 1y ago
    Oh that’s absolutely part of it.
    - cluckindan 1y ago
      Is it not a bit disingenuous to imply that cannabis causes the suicidality if it is actually the cessation of (self-)treatment that causes it?
      - chisleu 1y ago
        I don't know brother. I'm not making that claim. I'm repeating it.
        cluckindan 1y ago
        That’s generally how misinformation propagates. Hearsay.
        chisleu 1y ago
        Yeah except it's not hearsay so much as repeating a credible source.
- _Algernon_ 1y ago
  Citation needed
  - chisleu 1y ago
    Heard it from the doctor on mtv. Remember that show?
    - _Algernon_ 1y ago
      No
      - chisleu 1y ago
        Dr Drew and Adam Corola had a show on MTV where they discussed it at length.
        cluckindan 1y ago
        LoveLine? ”Carolla co-hosted the syndicated radio call-in program Loveline with Drew Pinsky from 1995 to 2005 as well as the show's television incarnation on MTV from 1996 to 2000.” Pinsky is seemingly a medical doctor specializing in addiction treatment. Just saying that he has a financial incentive to present hyperbole, not to mention a dramatic one (anything for more content in his rehab TV shows)
- haswell 1y ago
  People don’t take the withdrawal potential seriously. I’ve had a complex relationship with cannabis over the years, and one of the things that I didn’t understand before getting stuck in a daily habit of heavy use for a period of time is how hard it can be on your body to just stop. I had major upset stomach and food aversion for a few weeks to the point that I lost 10 pounds, major sleep issues, a major spike in depressive symptoms (not just baseline depression, because I eventually got back to baseline), etc.
  - chisleu 1y ago
    Same. After enough use, I just kind of forgot how to have fun without it. Sleep issues are the worst.
  - cluckindan 1y ago
    Anecdotes are not helpful here. Did you commonly have an upset stomach and food aversion before?
    - haswell 1y ago
      No, upset stomach and food aversion were not common for me before. I've gone through the quitting process several times over the years, and the experience was consistent each time. I've also run experiments while quitting like: what happens to the food aversion and stomach issues if I use some cannabis? When in the middle of withdrawal, it was like flipping a switch that allowed me to eat again. These symptoms are well known among the cannabis community, and there is increasing awareness in the medical community [0] especially for people who experience the most extreme forms like CHS [1], which has become increasingly common with more people using extremely high % THC products. If you're curious about this subject, I'd highly recommend reading the thousands of 1st hand accounts of the quitting process on a subreddit like /r/petioles or /r/leaves. It's extremely common for people to be skeptical of cannabis addiction/withdrawal [2], and I'm pretty certain this is an overcorrection after the decades of demonization and straight-up lies about cannabis. This is understandable, but the pendulum is gradually swinging back as more people experience difficulties quitting. I'm still in favor of legal cannabis, but the addiction potential is very real and worth highlighting. Part of the issue currently is that research is decades behind at this point due to the federal scheduling of the drug, and much of the research we do have was conducted with old low-THC strains. Hopefully we'll get better studies that highlight the things many heavy users already know 1st hand. - [0] https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9110555/ https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9110555/ - [1] https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/21665-cannabis-hyperemesis-syndrome https://my.clevelandclinic.org/health/diseases/21665-cannabi... - [2] https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2023/07/31/marijuana-addiction-legal-recreational-sales/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2023/07/31/marijuana-a...
- cluckindan 1y ago
  That effect could be simply due to pre-existing pathology such as anxiety, depression or even PTSD, not necessarily due to cannabis. Do you have a source for those statistics?

owebmaster 1y ago

Some of us are smoking for the past 20, 30, 40 years without cardiovascular issues tho. And I have met many old guys and ladies smoking weed in their 60, 70s doing fine if not better than their peers.

Popeyes 1y ago
You can only meet the ones who haven't died.
0xbadcafebee 1y ago
There are many old guys who smoke a pack of cigarettes a day for their whole life. There's many more guys who aren't as old because they died from smoking a pack of cigarettes a day. (I'm not saying weed causes these issues, but I am saying anecdotes are less than useful)
- owebmaster 1y ago
  I have met many smokers with diseases directly related to the habit of smoking cigarettes. I have never met a cannabis smoker in the same situation or that developed it over time (20 years span). Obviously, cannabis smokers also die from heart diseases but if smoking cannabis was something that would be related to heart attacks we would know by now, a research would not be needed or it would be quite obvious and accepted.
  - bluGill 1y ago
    Cannabis was illegal for many years in most countries (it often still is, but the laws are ignored). There have not been many studies year, given the timelines of the law enforcement I'd expect that we would first see the long term studies start to come out now. And of course the first studies will not be conclusive.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]

harimau777 1y ago

I think that a lot of drug users (at least in America) use drugs to escape their circumstances. IMHO, what's needed is to help people improve their circumstances so that they have better alternatives. Unfortunately, that is sorely lacking in America.