4 ms·

The same news from 5 days ago(117 comments): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44374761 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44374761 I wouldn't romanticize

by mrtksn 1y ago

The same news from 5 days ago(117 comments): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44374761 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44374761 I wouldn't romanticize it that much. Tesla used to be: Unmatched software(+), unmatched electronics(+), Save the planet(+), great subsidies(+), electric car that doesn't look weird(+), USA and Startups and the future(+), unmatched acceleration(+), low built quality(-), Shitty driving dynamics(-) Now alternatives are pretty good, so still Unmatched software(+) but the difference is not that big and the rest doesn't look good. No longer saving the planet because you don't save the planet with fascists, USA is no longer cool(hostile and clown-like), tech guys are no longer cool(greedy and sleazy and meddle with politics instead of doing cool shit), the design is dated and boring now and there are many alternatives doing much better in many other characteristics. So Tesla still sells very well when the price is right, match the new situation and it sells. Tasla sells like hot cakes in Turkey for example because they introduced a version specifically for the Turkish regulations and that particular configuration is taxed just %10 when the cheapest petrol cars are taxed %80. AFAIK Tesla keeps selling well in Norway too.

baxtr 1y ago
And just recently added "shitty brand image (-)"
- mrtksn 1y ago
  True. The prince needs to match that to sell. In Europe if you are going to buy a Tesla better have a really good price to compensate for this.
- imachine1980_ 1y ago
  Brand image is really important ev where already better in china than any other place in the world before Tesla but Tesla give the allure that the tech need to have mass appeal. That's why it was so successful as a company
  - stranded22 1y ago
    I thought it was really successful as a company due to all the carbon credit handouts it received from government, which it sold to the other car companies. That, and the lies from the man who owns a social media company (albeit later)
    - ethbr1 1y ago
      Tesla made a little under 3% of its 2024 revenue from carbon credits. It made those credits because it sells electric cars in volume. I get the Musk bashing, and think the guy's an asshat, but isn't this literally what carbon credits are supposed to do -- funnel cash from dirty industries to carbon negative ones, as another channel of funding for them?
      - stranded22 1y ago
        In 2023, it made 30% of its net quarterly income from carbon credit sales. That’s substantial. https://www.perplexity.ai/search/76c762eb-b4cf-445c-8f0a-19525eb3438d#1 https://www.perplexity.ai/search/76c762eb-b4cf-445c-8f0a-195...
        ethbr1 1y ago
        You mean Q4 2024? https://carboncredits.com/teslas-carbon-credit-revenue-soars-to-2-76-billion-amid-profit-drop/ https://carboncredits.com/teslas-carbon-credit-revenue-soars... Yes, because you're looking at net income vs something that is entirely profit. Of course it's going to be a large portion. That's like saying AWS is most of Amazon: it certainly contributes a ton of margin, but there's a lot of other revenue.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
Yardsed 1y ago
[flagged]
- mrtksn 1y ago
  I always assumed that pro-fascism folks don't trust him as he's not really in this for the right reasons. He must be the ultimate poser, "useful for now" in these circles.
- tim333 1y ago
  Musk is anti-White?
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - Yardsed 1y ago
    [flagged]
stavros 1y ago
This is spot on, I bought a BYD instead of a Tesla because of the reasons above. The build quality was better, the subsidy was great, and the Tesla brand is associated with Musk, so it's not a brand I personally want to touch.
- la_fayette 1y ago
  Ok but the association of BYD with China is also something I personally have reservations with.
  - arkitaip 1y ago
    99% of the stuff you buy is "associated" with China.
    - devn0ll 1y ago
      Both Audi (as an example) and BYD have chinese components. Yes. But with Audi they feel obligated to check the whole car for correct functioning. Including chinese chips. Making sure there are no backdoors (For example) in those chips. If not for themselves and the customer then for the security of the whole country. At least that option exists.. BYD has no such feelings or obligations. In fact, the opposite. Also: I do not understand ANYONE opting for a cheap Chinese car, knowing that they are screwing their own and their children's future once all the other options are priced out of the market. Once they have the market: kneel down before them. Also 2: This is one of the few cases where tariff's could actually correctly be applied.
  - npteljes 1y ago
    Tesla is also associated with China: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigafactory_Shanghai#Production https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigafactory_Shanghai#Productio...
m463 1y ago
I also think they went too far past "elegant simplicity". No turn signal stalks? Need to quickly reverse if you stuck your nose out too far? (no stalk anymore) Need defrost now? (search on touchscreen) I think it's now "cost-cuting ergonomic poverty", sort of like how macs lost too many ports.

by mrtksn 1y ago

baxtr 1y ago

And just recently added "shitty brand image (-)"

mrtksn 1y ago
True. The prince needs to match that to sell. In Europe if you are going to buy a Tesla better have a really good price to compensate for this.
imachine1980_ 1y ago
Brand image is really important ev where already better in china than any other place in the world before Tesla but Tesla give the allure that the tech need to have mass appeal. That's why it was so successful as a company
- stranded22 1y ago
  I thought it was really successful as a company due to all the carbon credit handouts it received from government, which it sold to the other car companies. That, and the lies from the man who owns a social media company (albeit later)
  - ethbr1 1y ago
    Tesla made a little under 3% of its 2024 revenue from carbon credits. It made those credits because it sells electric cars in volume. I get the Musk bashing, and think the guy's an asshat, but isn't this literally what carbon credits are supposed to do -- funnel cash from dirty industries to carbon negative ones, as another channel of funding for them?
    - stranded22 1y ago
      In 2023, it made 30% of its net quarterly income from carbon credit sales. That’s substantial. https://www.perplexity.ai/search/76c762eb-b4cf-445c-8f0a-19525eb3438d#1 https://www.perplexity.ai/search/76c762eb-b4cf-445c-8f0a-195...
      - ethbr1 1y ago
        You mean Q4 2024? https://carboncredits.com/teslas-carbon-credit-revenue-soars-to-2-76-billion-amid-profit-drop/ https://carboncredits.com/teslas-carbon-credit-revenue-soars... Yes, because you're looking at net income vs something that is entirely profit. Of course it's going to be a large portion. That's like saying AWS is most of Amazon: it certainly contributes a ton of margin, but there's a lot of other revenue.

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

Yardsed 1y ago

[flagged]

mrtksn 1y ago
I always assumed that pro-fascism folks don't trust him as he's not really in this for the right reasons. He must be the ultimate poser, "useful for now" in these circles.
tim333 1y ago
Musk is anti-White?
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- Yardsed 1y ago
  [flagged]

stavros 1y ago

This is spot on, I bought a BYD instead of a Tesla because of the reasons above. The build quality was better, the subsidy was great, and the Tesla brand is associated with Musk, so it's not a brand I personally want to touch.

la_fayette 1y ago
Ok but the association of BYD with China is also something I personally have reservations with.
- arkitaip 1y ago
  99% of the stuff you buy is "associated" with China.
  - devn0ll 1y ago
    Both Audi (as an example) and BYD have chinese components. Yes. But with Audi they feel obligated to check the whole car for correct functioning. Including chinese chips. Making sure there are no backdoors (For example) in those chips. If not for themselves and the customer then for the security of the whole country. At least that option exists.. BYD has no such feelings or obligations. In fact, the opposite. Also: I do not understand ANYONE opting for a cheap Chinese car, knowing that they are screwing their own and their children's future once all the other options are priced out of the market. Once they have the market: kneel down before them. Also 2: This is one of the few cases where tariff's could actually correctly be applied.
- npteljes 1y ago
  Tesla is also associated with China: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigafactory_Shanghai#Production https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gigafactory_Shanghai#Productio...

m463 1y ago

I also think they went too far past "elegant simplicity". No turn signal stalks? Need to quickly reverse if you stuck your nose out too far? (no stalk anymore) Need defrost now? (search on touchscreen) I think it's now "cost-cuting ergonomic poverty", sort of like how macs lost too many ports.