4 ms·

Maybe I'm being reductionist, but it is rather obvious that if someone likes gambling but doesn't have access to it due to their age, they will reach for gaming

Maybe I'm being reductionist, but it is rather obvious that if someone likes gambling but doesn't have access to it due to their age, they will reach for gaming as the closest substitute, sure. That doesn't mean that gaming makes you like gambling. There are many player archetypes, some of which get enjoyment out of games from factors that are quite dissimilar from gambling, and they will probably never gravitate towards it. I could see the reverse being true though, probably gambling does make you like some kinds of gaming. Also, this is saying that online gaming is correlated with online gambling. Well yeah, it's all sitting at the computer playing competitive games against strangers, money or not it's a similar activity. Indeed, they show no correlation between "playing games at 9" and "online gambling at 20". It might be the age difference, but it also might be that gaming in general has little correlation with online gambling, it's just competitive online gaming that correlates, which makes a lot of sense.

bitmasher9 1y ago
It makes some basic sense to say gambling is increasing among young men, and gaming is increasing in young men, maybe they are related. Their data is lacking to draw strong conclusions, but the question is interesting.
- dgfitz 1y ago
  Gambling increased because many states recently legalized it. Any other correlation is puff science. I know more than a few degenerate gamblers. My one buddy bets ~250k/yr, the rest are about ~100k. I'm like 10k (and through luck or skill I end every year up between 2-10k). I'm the only gamer of this group of 10 people, even as kids.
  - tokai 1y ago
    This research is not about the US. Also don't use a slur for homosexual to denigrate anything.
    - Macha 1y ago
      The slur is spelled differently, and puff science (and its predecessor term puff/puffery) predate the slur by over a century.
    - lan321 1y ago
      Slur for homosexual?
    - coffeecantcode 1y ago
      Puff is not a slur, puff science indicates that it’s vaporous or there is no basis or grounds. Poof on the other hand, could be taken as a slur, sure. Let’s relax.
qskousen 1y ago
> it is rather obvious that if someone likes gambling but doesn't have access to it due to their age, they will reach for gaming as the closest substitute, sure. How is that obvious? I'm not sure how those are connected. Maybe for a specific game, if that game has lootbox-like mechanics?
- oersted 1y ago
  What I had in mind is the simple thrill of winning against other people, and being able to do it from the comfort of your computer/phone, without having to actually deal with people face-to-face. In this sense, gambling is just about rising the stakes to get that emotional hit when just fake points don't do it for you anymore. I'm assuming that most online gambling is like poker where there is a degree, or at least an illusion, of skill and agency. Having some randomness involved is also quite appealing because you can keep hoping to get lucky and can win now and then even if you are not great at the game, it can still be fun to win even if you didn't really earn it. But I doubt many teenagers just keep pressing a button like in roulette or slots. Well there is loot-boxes of course, but that's more engaging since the rewards are tied to an actual game, there's the chance to show-off your winnings in the case of cosmetics, the collectable nature of the rewards, and sometimes the possibility to trade them for other items or real money. EDIT: There's also sports gambling which is massive, although not sure if there is any overlap with these people that flow from gaming.
  - Fire-Dragon-DoL 1y ago
    I mean, you could say that for any sport (not gambling). Winning against other people is an enormous context. You can even win an argument
corimaith 1y ago
Games are popular because they provide clear rules and instant rewards, almost like an "ideal job". Gambling is like the opposite of that and is tapping into a different part of the brain.
- verelo 1y ago
  I wouldn't completely agree with that. I was playing PUBG recently and hit suddenly hit me "This game is gambling". In PUBG: You walk into a house not knowing whats there. You find 'loot', you hoard it...and then maybe you get into a fight somewhere along the way. The game is 70% looting, 20% running and sometimes as little as 10% fighting other players. The looting is designed to feel like gambling. And i freaking love it. That's all to say, there's certainly rules and structure to the game, but a lot of what hooks me to these styles of games is the chance element. I just didn't realize until very recently (I'm now 39...took a minute to pickup on it)
  - axus 1y ago
    I think gambling means money is at risk, and can be won. Or something with well-defined monetary value, on both sides of the transaction. Types of gambling could be sorted by how much control you have over the probabilities.
  - anon22981 1y ago
    Just for anyone unfamiliar with the game or these types of games and to put out an opposing view — I disagree that the experience of BR games have anything to do with the experience of gambling. I’ve done both and find pretty much nothing in common. (The cosmetic gambling obviously is very much gambling, though, and is unfortunatly a big part of the game.)
INTPenis 1y ago
Might also be a connection between risk takers and gamblers. At least when I was growing up it wasn't always games, it was often general risk taking that signified the future gamblers.
chilmers 1y ago
I'm not sure how much sense it makes to talk about 9 year old children "liking" gambling. Sure, genetic predisposition undoubtedly plays a role in any behaviour, but do you really think childhood experiences have no effect on shaping adult behaviour? Kids brains are still developing and it's hardly a stretch to suggest that uncontrolled exposure to heavily-optimised addiction generators could encourage a gambling habit as much as exploit an inherent tendency.
compyman 1y ago
I think this might underestimate how gambling + kids games can reinforce destructive behavior. There are lots of similar tools that casino owners/game designers/sports betting apps/social media/&c use to build addiction into their products, all while offloading responsibility onto individual consumers. A really interesting study of this is the book 'Addiction by Design' by Natasha Dow Schüll examines this in the context of slot machines/video poker/casino games, but you can see the same process at work basically wherever you look.

bitmasher9 1y ago

It makes some basic sense to say gambling is increasing among young men, and gaming is increasing in young men, maybe they are related. Their data is lacking to draw strong conclusions, but the question is interesting.

dgfitz 1y ago
Gambling increased because many states recently legalized it. Any other correlation is puff science. I know more than a few degenerate gamblers. My one buddy bets ~250k/yr, the rest are about ~100k. I'm like 10k (and through luck or skill I end every year up between 2-10k). I'm the only gamer of this group of 10 people, even as kids.
- tokai 1y ago
  This research is not about the US. Also don't use a slur for homosexual to denigrate anything.
  - Macha 1y ago
    The slur is spelled differently, and puff science (and its predecessor term puff/puffery) predate the slur by over a century.
  - lan321 1y ago
    Slur for homosexual?
  - coffeecantcode 1y ago
    Puff is not a slur, puff science indicates that it’s vaporous or there is no basis or grounds. Poof on the other hand, could be taken as a slur, sure. Let’s relax.

qskousen 1y ago

> it is rather obvious that if someone likes gambling but doesn't have access to it due to their age, they will reach for gaming as the closest substitute, sure. How is that obvious? I'm not sure how those are connected. Maybe for a specific game, if that game has lootbox-like mechanics?

oersted 1y ago
What I had in mind is the simple thrill of winning against other people, and being able to do it from the comfort of your computer/phone, without having to actually deal with people face-to-face. In this sense, gambling is just about rising the stakes to get that emotional hit when just fake points don't do it for you anymore. I'm assuming that most online gambling is like poker where there is a degree, or at least an illusion, of skill and agency. Having some randomness involved is also quite appealing because you can keep hoping to get lucky and can win now and then even if you are not great at the game, it can still be fun to win even if you didn't really earn it. But I doubt many teenagers just keep pressing a button like in roulette or slots. Well there is loot-boxes of course, but that's more engaging since the rewards are tied to an actual game, there's the chance to show-off your winnings in the case of cosmetics, the collectable nature of the rewards, and sometimes the possibility to trade them for other items or real money. EDIT: There's also sports gambling which is massive, although not sure if there is any overlap with these people that flow from gaming.
- Fire-Dragon-DoL 1y ago
  I mean, you could say that for any sport (not gambling). Winning against other people is an enormous context. You can even win an argument

corimaith 1y ago

Games are popular because they provide clear rules and instant rewards, almost like an "ideal job". Gambling is like the opposite of that and is tapping into a different part of the brain.

verelo 1y ago
I wouldn't completely agree with that. I was playing PUBG recently and hit suddenly hit me "This game is gambling". In PUBG: You walk into a house not knowing whats there. You find 'loot', you hoard it...and then maybe you get into a fight somewhere along the way. The game is 70% looting, 20% running and sometimes as little as 10% fighting other players. The looting is designed to feel like gambling. And i freaking love it. That's all to say, there's certainly rules and structure to the game, but a lot of what hooks me to these styles of games is the chance element. I just didn't realize until very recently (I'm now 39...took a minute to pickup on it)
- axus 1y ago
  I think gambling means money is at risk, and can be won. Or something with well-defined monetary value, on both sides of the transaction. Types of gambling could be sorted by how much control you have over the probabilities.
- anon22981 1y ago
  Just for anyone unfamiliar with the game or these types of games and to put out an opposing view — I disagree that the experience of BR games have anything to do with the experience of gambling. I’ve done both and find pretty much nothing in common. (The cosmetic gambling obviously is very much gambling, though, and is unfortunatly a big part of the game.)

INTPenis 1y ago

Might also be a connection between risk takers and gamblers. At least when I was growing up it wasn't always games, it was often general risk taking that signified the future gamblers.

chilmers 1y ago

I'm not sure how much sense it makes to talk about 9 year old children "liking" gambling. Sure, genetic predisposition undoubtedly plays a role in any behaviour, but do you really think childhood experiences have no effect on shaping adult behaviour? Kids brains are still developing and it's hardly a stretch to suggest that uncontrolled exposure to heavily-optimised addiction generators could encourage a gambling habit as much as exploit an inherent tendency.

compyman 1y ago

I think this might underestimate how gambling + kids games can reinforce destructive behavior. There are lots of similar tools that casino owners/game designers/sports betting apps/social media/&c use to build addiction into their products, all while offloading responsibility onto individual consumers. A really interesting study of this is the book 'Addiction by Design' by Natasha Dow Schüll examines this in the context of slot machines/video poker/casino games, but you can see the same process at work basically wherever you look.