3 ms·

What are you talking about? Multiple EU countries have free speech written in their constituion. Article 5 in German basic law (their constitution): https://ww

• mslansn 1y ago
  Germany? Must be some dark joke. You know how many things can get you fined there?
  • barbazoo 1y ago
    What are you referring to? Denying the Holocaust? Making nazi salutes? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_the_Federal_Republic_of_Germany https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Censorship_in_the_Federal_Re...
    • 698969 1y ago
      Calling someone an asshole, or calling them a racist if they seem to discriminate you based on your race, saying a restaurant isn't good etc. can very easily get you sued in Germany.
      • barbazoo 1y ago
        Do you have examples for each of those?
        • immibis 1y ago
          https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/comments/14fu1fm/legally_threatened_for_leaving_a_negative_review/ https://www.reddit.com/r/germany/comments/14fu1fm/legally_th... https://se-legal.de/criminal-defense-lawyer/defamation-libel-lawyer-germany/?lang=en https://se-legal.de/criminal-defense-lawyer/defamation-libel...
    • msgodel 1y ago
      Heh. If you can't do that you don't have free speech. That's what free speech means.
      • watwut 1y ago
        And yet, they are more democratic and more free then USA. And currently less nazi too.
        • msgodel 1y ago
          How do you know they're "less nazi" and not just self censoring? Also if that's what people want isn't it less democratic to suppress it? Things like free speech and voting are more a service to the elites for this reason IMO.
          • immibis 1y ago
            They are in fact self censoring. I live there and many people are just Nazis. It's illegal to be a Nazi, but the law works on facts you can prove in court, and the only way you can prove that is if they, for example, yelled Heil Hitler, or did the salute, or waved a swastika flag. As long as they're not too obvious about it, it's de facto allowed. Some people are still stupid enough to do the obvious signs of course.
          • watwut 1y ago
            No, it is not less democratic to suppress movements whose explicit goal is dictatorship and abuse of other people.
  • af78 1y ago
    https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/freedom-of-expression-index https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/freedom-of-expression-ind... Freedom of expression index (higher is better) Germany: 0.94 USA: 0.89
• perihelions 1y ago
  > "Multiple EU countries have free speech written in their constituion." That's an exceedingly low bar! We need more critical thinking than that to start a substantive discussion about comparative freedoms across political systems. A government can't just declare itself to be a free country; it's practical reality which matters. Exhibits A, B, & C: > "Citizens of the People's Republic of China shall enjoy freedom of speech, the press, assembly, association, procession and demonstration" https://english.www.gov.cn/archive/laws_regulations/2014/08/23/content_281474982987458.htm https://english.www.gov.cn/archive/laws_regulations/2014/08/... ("Constitution of the People’s Republic of China") https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_People%27s_Republic_of_China https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Constitution_of_the_People%27... > "In conformity with the interests of the toilers, and in order to strengthen the socialist system, the citizens of the U.S.S.R. are guaranteed by law:—(a) Freedom of speech; (b) Freedom of the Press; (c) Freedom of assembly and of holding mass meetings; (d) Freedom of street processions and demonstrations..." https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Soviet_Socialist_Constitution_of_december_5,_1936.djvu/30 https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Page:The_Soviet_Socialist_Con... ("Constitution of the Soviet Union (1936)") > "Citizens are guaranteed freedom of speech, the press, assembly, demonstration and association. The State shall guarantee the conditions for the free activities of democratic political parties and social organizations." https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Socialist_Constitution_of_the_Democratic_People%27s_Republic_of_Korea_(2023)#CHAPTER_V._FUNDAMENTAL_RIGHTS_AND_DUTIES_OF_CITIZENS https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Socialist_Constitution_of_the... ("Socialist Constitution of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea (2023)")
  • f_devd 1y ago
    You have to assume the country in question follows has a Rule of Law. You're argument also works against the US as of recently, less so against Germany.
  • oeitho 1y ago
    The flagged comment I responded to claimed that no EU country had free speech in their constitution. My comment was in response to that.