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>actually lowering energy costs isn't green energy worth higher energy costs?

evklein 1y ago
Additionally, renewables have their own drawbacks - their volatility makes reliability more challenging and thus brings energy prices higher. Nuclear has the benefit of providing consistent base load, something that's needed more now than ever. That kind of thing might be worth the investment, but until now no one has wanted to put up the kind of money needed for that level of reliability.
- Workaccount2 1y ago
  In a state the size of New York, the sun is always shining or the wind always blowing somewhere in the state. You then use battery back-up to fill the gaps and gas to fill the gaps of the filled gaps. The latest nuclear plant in the US was the completion of the Vogtle plant in Georgia, which ran a staggering $22B over budget. Twenty Two Billion Dollars over budget! $22B, is enough to build the largest solar plant in the US 10 times over (total 5GW). Or about 7 of the largest wind farm (total 10.5GW). Or 33 of the largest battery storage plant. With $2B left over for logistics. And $14B left over for anything else because the total cost was $36B! The current state of nuclear doesn't make sense anyway you cut it.
  - throw0101c 1y ago
    > The latest nuclear plant in the US was the completion of the Vogtle plant in Georgia, which ran a staggering $22B over budget. Twenty Two Billion Dollars over budget! And Unit 4 was (IIRC) 30% cheaper than Unit 3. Because with Unit 3 they had to learn everything about building a nuclear power plant from scratch (from a practical, steel-toed boots on the ground perspective). Now that there's (a) an actual supply chain (brought up from scratch), and (b) people with a workflow on how to build AP1000s, future units will decrease costs over time. During the 1990s and into the 2000s Japan was bringing up nuclear plants in 4-5 years like clockwork: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_commercial_nuclear_reactors#Japan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_commercial_nuclear_rea... Turns economies of scale work as well for 900MW power plants as for $9 widgets. The Decouple podcast has a four-part series on Vogtle and what they did wrong (and right): * https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLyouH0mkPJXHR0hKW_iLkIBCsu5D5xO2b https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLyouH0mkPJXHR0hKW_iLk...
  - Saline9515 1y ago
    I think that you need to consider the cost of a blackout due to unreliable electricity production. This is the wealthiest area of the world, so any blackout or even threat that it may happen would be very costly, which is why you need redundancy and can't rely on one power source.
bryanlarsen 1y ago
Perhaps, but we don't need to and shouldn't pay more for green energy. In 2025 the cheapest 24/7 energy grid is 90% green, up to 97% green in sunny locations. https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-every-hour-of-every-day-is-here-and-it-changes-everything/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-e...
eej71 1y ago
No. Lower energy costs saves lives. Energy is the life blood of civilization.
exiguus 1y ago
no,nuclear-power is much more expensive but it gets subvention on company level. That's why the end-user pay less for now.

Additionally, renewables have their own drawbacks - their volatility makes reliability more challenging and thus brings energy prices higher. Nuclear has the benefit of providing consistent base load, something that's needed more now than ever. That kind of thing might be worth the investment, but until now no one has wanted to put up the kind of money needed for that level of reliability.

Workaccount2 1y ago
In a state the size of New York, the sun is always shining or the wind always blowing somewhere in the state. You then use battery back-up to fill the gaps and gas to fill the gaps of the filled gaps. The latest nuclear plant in the US was the completion of the Vogtle plant in Georgia, which ran a staggering $22B over budget. Twenty Two Billion Dollars over budget! $22B, is enough to build the largest solar plant in the US 10 times over (total 5GW). Or about 7 of the largest wind farm (total 10.5GW). Or 33 of the largest battery storage plant. With $2B left over for logistics. And $14B left over for anything else because the total cost was $36B! The current state of nuclear doesn't make sense anyway you cut it.
- throw0101c 1y ago
  > The latest nuclear plant in the US was the completion of the Vogtle plant in Georgia, which ran a staggering $22B over budget. Twenty Two Billion Dollars over budget! And Unit 4 was (IIRC) 30% cheaper than Unit 3. Because with Unit 3 they had to learn everything about building a nuclear power plant from scratch (from a practical, steel-toed boots on the ground perspective). Now that there's (a) an actual supply chain (brought up from scratch), and (b) people with a workflow on how to build AP1000s, future units will decrease costs over time. During the 1990s and into the 2000s Japan was bringing up nuclear plants in 4-5 years like clockwork: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_commercial_nuclear_reactors#Japan https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_commercial_nuclear_rea... Turns economies of scale work as well for 900MW power plants as for $9 widgets. The Decouple podcast has a four-part series on Vogtle and what they did wrong (and right): * https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLyouH0mkPJXHR0hKW_iLkIBCsu5D5xO2b https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLyouH0mkPJXHR0hKW_iLk...
- Saline9515 1y ago
  I think that you need to consider the cost of a blackout due to unreliable electricity production. This is the wealthiest area of the world, so any blackout or even threat that it may happen would be very costly, which is why you need redundancy and can't rely on one power source.

bryanlarsen 1y ago

Perhaps, but we don't need to and shouldn't pay more for green energy. In 2025 the cheapest 24/7 energy grid is 90% green, up to 97% green in sunny locations. https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-every-hour-of-every-day-is-here-and-it-changes-everything/ https://ember-energy.org/latest-insights/solar-electricity-e...

eej71 1y ago

No. Lower energy costs saves lives. Energy is the life blood of civilization.

exiguus 1y ago

no,nuclear-power is much more expensive but it gets subvention on company level. That's why the end-user pay less for now.