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So repatriating your own property is now pro-Russian propaganda? Unless country is defenseless what is wrong with keeping one's things at one's place

by FpUser 1y ago

littlestymaar 1y ago
Both things can be true at once: the politicians talking can have legitimates arguments while being part of pro-Russian parties that don't have power in Germany and do not represent the German government opinion.
- FpUser 1y ago
  Well then the arguments should be considered on their merits without bringing political BS. Otherwise following the logic if Afd tells Merz not to jump from that bridge he should do the opposite.
  - littlestymaar 1y ago
    It's not the argument made in the top level post, they are just saying “What I'm trying to say is that these two do not represent the German political landscape at all. […] This is not a debate happening in Germany right now and no other party has expressed support of any position.” Maybe there should be a real debate on that topic, or maybe Germany should even pursue such a repatriation of their gold reserves, but as a matter of fact there's no such debate or plan besides fringes parties, that's it.
pydry 1y ago
In general America considers non puppets to be puppets of another country and considers only its own puppets to be truly "free". This is as true in the middle east, europe, africa, south america or asia.
vincnetas 1y ago
Usually russian propoganda is anything that stirs internal conflict. This does not mean that any internal conflict is russia propoganda, but they are very quick to try amplify any conflicts. This is KGB strategy of active measures (subversion). Read more here : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuri_Bezmenov https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuri_Bezmenov
- FpUser 1y ago
  So the logical conclusion would be that if anyone tries to criticize their government the higher up will just declare it pro-Russian and make person shut-up? How fucking convenient. Maybe it is better to stop looking for Putin under one's bed and take responsibility for own fuckups.
dubbel 1y ago
We are talking about national gold reserves, not some household items. They exist for the reason to liquidate them in case of national emergencies/severe economic crises. It's easier to liquidate these reserves when they are stored in trading hubs. That could be New York and London, or maybe even Shanghai, if China wasn't a systemic rival. Storing all of them at "one's place" is a larger risk than splitting it up and storing them in several places, each with a different risk profile.
- FpUser 1y ago
  >"It's easier to liquidate these reserves when they are stored in trading hubs" Does that happen often (gold sale)?
  - holowoodman 1y ago
    every other world war or so...
    - FpUser 1y ago
      Well, if WWIII starts they will not be cashing in their gold no matter where it is kept and world financial capitals would be the last places to survive strikes.
AnimalMuppet 1y ago
From World War II, the problem with keeping it at your own place was that, if someone overruns your country, your government-in-exile may be able to keep control of gold that is outside your country. Gold that is inside your country, however, is controlled by the invader. (And may be looted by them. Even if you later get your country back, the gold may be gone.) That exposes you to the risk of the country holding it. But for much of recent history, the US was seen as a lesser risk than a Russian invasion. Whether that is still the way the risks balance... I think we each may hold our own opinion on that.
- FpUser 1y ago
  >"...But for much of recent history, the US was seen as a lesser risk than a Russian invasion. Whether that is still the way the risks balance..." Can't tell about the past where the risks of war with USSR were valid, but I think Russia invading Germany or Italy in the future is pure BS.
  - AnimalMuppet 1y ago
    Well, influential people (that is, people fairly close to Putin) in Russia are saying that, after Ukraine, Russia will take Poland. Yeah, that's not Germany, still less Italy. But it's much closer to Germany than I would be comfortable with if I were German... [Edit: First example I could find: https://www.newsweek.com/putin-ally-says-poland-next-ukraine-war-rant-russian-tv-1860470 https://www.newsweek.com/putin-ally-says-poland-next-ukraine... I believe that Medvedev also said similar things, but I can't immediately find a link.]
    - abyssin 1y ago
      Could you provide links for these declarations?
    - FpUser 1y ago
      Duma does not make any major decisions. They just rubber stamp what Putin tells them to. Medvedev is Putin's toy. Listening to them is the same as to some western lunatics who while formally being part government spit some bullshit like "the world flat."
52-6F-62 1y ago
In this case, if you’re American. It signals a loss of trust in them which is an impossible absurdity if your a priori is that America is the eternal good and only future for us all. Can’t have that.
- hiergiltdiestfu 1y ago
  After skimming through the comments derailed into AfD/BSW discussions, I'm happy to find this comment, because as a non-extremist German, this is the reason I want the German gold out of the USA. Right now, it makes as much sense as storing the gold in North Korea. It will just be held hostage or stolen by the local dictator.

So repatriating your own property is now pro-Russian propaganda? Unless country is defenseless what is wrong with keeping one's things at one's place

by FpUser 1y ago

So repatriating your own property is now pro-Russian propaganda? Unless country is defenseless what is wrong with keeping one's things at one's place

littlestymaar 1y ago

Both things can be true at once: the politicians talking can have legitimates arguments while being part of pro-Russian parties that don't have power in Germany and do not represent the German government opinion.

FpUser 1y ago
Well then the arguments should be considered on their merits without bringing political BS. Otherwise following the logic if Afd tells Merz not to jump from that bridge he should do the opposite.
- littlestymaar 1y ago
  It's not the argument made in the top level post, they are just saying “What I'm trying to say is that these two do not represent the German political landscape at all. […] This is not a debate happening in Germany right now and no other party has expressed support of any position.” Maybe there should be a real debate on that topic, or maybe Germany should even pursue such a repatriation of their gold reserves, but as a matter of fact there's no such debate or plan besides fringes parties, that's it.

pydry 1y ago

In general America considers non puppets to be puppets of another country and considers only its own puppets to be truly "free". This is as true in the middle east, europe, africa, south america or asia.

vincnetas 1y ago

Usually russian propoganda is anything that stirs internal conflict. This does not mean that any internal conflict is russia propoganda, but they are very quick to try amplify any conflicts. This is KGB strategy of active measures (subversion). Read more here : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuri_Bezmenov https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuri_Bezmenov

FpUser 1y ago
So the logical conclusion would be that if anyone tries to criticize their government the higher up will just declare it pro-Russian and make person shut-up? How fucking convenient. Maybe it is better to stop looking for Putin under one's bed and take responsibility for own fuckups.

dubbel 1y ago

We are talking about national gold reserves, not some household items. They exist for the reason to liquidate them in case of national emergencies/severe economic crises. It's easier to liquidate these reserves when they are stored in trading hubs. That could be New York and London, or maybe even Shanghai, if China wasn't a systemic rival. Storing all of them at "one's place" is a larger risk than splitting it up and storing them in several places, each with a different risk profile.

FpUser 1y ago
>"It's easier to liquidate these reserves when they are stored in trading hubs" Does that happen often (gold sale)?
- holowoodman 1y ago
  every other world war or so...
  - FpUser 1y ago
    Well, if WWIII starts they will not be cashing in their gold no matter where it is kept and world financial capitals would be the last places to survive strikes.

AnimalMuppet 1y ago

From World War II, the problem with keeping it at your own place was that, if someone overruns your country, your government-in-exile may be able to keep control of gold that is outside your country. Gold that is inside your country, however, is controlled by the invader. (And may be looted by them. Even if you later get your country back, the gold may be gone.) That exposes you to the risk of the country holding it. But for much of recent history, the US was seen as a lesser risk than a Russian invasion. Whether that is still the way the risks balance... I think we each may hold our own opinion on that.

FpUser 1y ago
>"...But for much of recent history, the US was seen as a lesser risk than a Russian invasion. Whether that is still the way the risks balance..." Can't tell about the past where the risks of war with USSR were valid, but I think Russia invading Germany or Italy in the future is pure BS.
- AnimalMuppet 1y ago
  Well, influential people (that is, people fairly close to Putin) in Russia are saying that, after Ukraine, Russia will take Poland. Yeah, that's not Germany, still less Italy. But it's much closer to Germany than I would be comfortable with if I were German... [Edit: First example I could find: https://www.newsweek.com/putin-ally-says-poland-next-ukraine-war-rant-russian-tv-1860470 https://www.newsweek.com/putin-ally-says-poland-next-ukraine... I believe that Medvedev also said similar things, but I can't immediately find a link.]
  - abyssin 1y ago
    Could you provide links for these declarations?
  - FpUser 1y ago
    Duma does not make any major decisions. They just rubber stamp what Putin tells them to. Medvedev is Putin's toy. Listening to them is the same as to some western lunatics who while formally being part government spit some bullshit like "the world flat."

52-6F-62 1y ago

In this case, if you’re American. It signals a loss of trust in them which is an impossible absurdity if your a priori is that America is the eternal good and only future for us all. Can’t have that.

hiergiltdiestfu 1y ago
After skimming through the comments derailed into AfD/BSW discussions, I'm happy to find this comment, because as a non-extremist German, this is the reason I want the German gold out of the USA. Right now, it makes as much sense as storing the gold in North Korea. It will just be held hostage or stolen by the local dictator.