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Amazing. Do you people understand that this is the most oppressive policy ever among any country? In American movies dictatorships are portrayed as regimes tha

by mrtksn 1y ago

Amazing. Do you people understand that this is the most oppressive policy ever among any country? In American movies dictatorships are portrayed as regimes that are able to control every aspect of their citizen's lives but in real life dictators don't do that. This is why there's the myth among the alt-right about how free Russia is. In real life, only the relevant people are bothered and the rest do whatever they want, say whatever they think. Just don't say it at the wrong place. USA is going for the US style dystopia and the American dystopia is totalitarian. I'm sure some will think "This is only for the foreigners, it makes sense to know what they are up to". Once you are done implementing it for foreigners you will want to know what citizens are up to because the rhetoric of these people is not only about the "dangerous aliens among us", they talk about traitor all the time. They will want to know who are those traitors to keep them from infiltrating key positions and you have all kind of traitors already. It's not just national traitor, it's also gender traitors, race traitor, language traitors, fiscal traitors, history traitors, religion traitors, traitor traitors. The speed of US descending into darkness is scary.

msgodel 1y ago
The vaccine mandates were far more oppressive, and I'd argue the individual healthcare federal mandate was also far more oppressive. this only affects non-citizens. If the federal government were going around asking for citizens social media I'd be more inclined to agree with you. That's not what they're doing though.
- mrtksn 1y ago
  I don't know how the vaccine mandates were enforced in US but two wrongs don't make it right. Why do you think that it affects only non-citizens?
  - msgodel 1y ago
    1) You said this was "the most oppressive policy." I gave two examples of more oppressive polices. 2) The vaccine mandates were enforced by having employers fire you for failure to comply with it. It was actually pretty terrible. 3) Visa holders are non-citizens by definition.
    - ujkhsjkdhf234 1y ago
      > 2) The vaccine mandates were enforced by having employers fire you for failure to comply with it. It was actually pretty terrible. When I was a kid, I had to have certain vaccines or I couldn't enroll in elementary school. Is that oppressive in your view?
    - mrtksn 1y ago
      You'll remember those as the good old days when you get fired for sanitary reasons. America has begun ideological checks at the gates, this will spread to weed out the enemy within. They don't have a PCR test for this, the test is your speech history. You will have to think the right way, they will need to be sure that you are not infected with a mindvirus. Today's pathogen is the woke mindvirus but maybe in near future other viruses will be discovered.
      - msgodel 1y ago
        >when you get fired for sanitary reasons Those are private policies, the vaccine mandate was a federal policy. You said you don't live here, take my word for it, there have been far more oppressive policies.
        mrtksn 1y ago
        Care to explain? What they did exactly? Is there more to it than “ if you want to come to the office, you must be vaccinated or you need to provide clean PCR test results”?
        msgodel 1y ago
        No. It had nothing to do with RTO and PCR was not an alternative. There was a federal policy (not legislated btw, just an EO for all the people complaining about Trump using EOs to undo previous EOs) that said any company with federal contracts (which is nearly all tech companies in the US, not just defense contractors) must have 100% of its employees vaccinated. It had nothing to do with safety since there was no provision for remote workers. Keep in mind this was very early on before they had any reasonable amount of time to even test the vaccines. Forced medical intervention like that as a federal policy is far more oppressive than just asking immigrants and vistors for social media handles, there isn't any debate to be had here.
potato3732842 1y ago
The problem is that people don't actually do enough stuff that puts them in adversarial contact with the government to realize how terrible it all is.
- mrtksn 1y ago
  That's also the default mode in countries like Russia, Turkey etc. No one bothers you %99.9 of the times, these countries don't have the capacity to enforce total control. With the spread of the internet, things changed a bit and people had realized that they must watch what they say online but it's still based on incidents, i.e. if your tweets go viral you go to jail. Otherwise, no one cares. carry on. US wants total control, they don't want to be in full know. It's in line with their intelligence gathering practices, it's the American way apparently.

by mrtksn 1y ago

msgodel 1y ago

The vaccine mandates were far more oppressive, and I'd argue the individual healthcare federal mandate was also far more oppressive. this only affects non-citizens. If the federal government were going around asking for citizens social media I'd be more inclined to agree with you. That's not what they're doing though.

mrtksn 1y ago
I don't know how the vaccine mandates were enforced in US but two wrongs don't make it right. Why do you think that it affects only non-citizens?
- msgodel 1y ago
  1) You said this was "the most oppressive policy." I gave two examples of more oppressive polices. 2) The vaccine mandates were enforced by having employers fire you for failure to comply with it. It was actually pretty terrible. 3) Visa holders are non-citizens by definition.
  - ujkhsjkdhf234 1y ago
    > 2) The vaccine mandates were enforced by having employers fire you for failure to comply with it. It was actually pretty terrible. When I was a kid, I had to have certain vaccines or I couldn't enroll in elementary school. Is that oppressive in your view?
  - mrtksn 1y ago
    You'll remember those as the good old days when you get fired for sanitary reasons. America has begun ideological checks at the gates, this will spread to weed out the enemy within. They don't have a PCR test for this, the test is your speech history. You will have to think the right way, they will need to be sure that you are not infected with a mindvirus. Today's pathogen is the woke mindvirus but maybe in near future other viruses will be discovered.
    - msgodel 1y ago
      >when you get fired for sanitary reasons Those are private policies, the vaccine mandate was a federal policy. You said you don't live here, take my word for it, there have been far more oppressive policies.
      - mrtksn 1y ago
        Care to explain? What they did exactly? Is there more to it than “ if you want to come to the office, you must be vaccinated or you need to provide clean PCR test results”?
        msgodel 1y ago
        No. It had nothing to do with RTO and PCR was not an alternative. There was a federal policy (not legislated btw, just an EO for all the people complaining about Trump using EOs to undo previous EOs) that said any company with federal contracts (which is nearly all tech companies in the US, not just defense contractors) must have 100% of its employees vaccinated. It had nothing to do with safety since there was no provision for remote workers. Keep in mind this was very early on before they had any reasonable amount of time to even test the vaccines. Forced medical intervention like that as a federal policy is far more oppressive than just asking immigrants and vistors for social media handles, there isn't any debate to be had here.

potato3732842 1y ago

The problem is that people don't actually do enough stuff that puts them in adversarial contact with the government to realize how terrible it all is.

mrtksn 1y ago
That's also the default mode in countries like Russia, Turkey etc. No one bothers you %99.9 of the times, these countries don't have the capacity to enforce total control. With the spread of the internet, things changed a bit and people had realized that they must watch what they say online but it's still based on incidents, i.e. if your tweets go viral you go to jail. Otherwise, no one cares. carry on. US wants total control, they don't want to be in full know. It's in line with their intelligence gathering practices, it's the American way apparently.