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Here's a human doing the same thing in the same video for the same reason: https://youtu.be/_s-h0YXtF0c?t=906 https://youtu.be/_s-h0YXtF0c?t=906

mahkeiro 1y ago
And so it’s ok to break traffic rules? In my country, as a human this will get you easily a one month license suspension.
- smallmancontrov 1y ago
  No, just a bit of perspective. I'm sure the video record of your car would be squeaky clean with no violations whatsoever.
  - pixelpoet 1y ago
    If I said I've never had a driver's licence, can we get back to the topic at hand? What's the thesis here, humans are imperfect drivers and therefore we should accept self driving cars driving into incoming traffic, and if anyone objects, focus on their faults instead?
    - smallmancontrov 1y ago
      We allow imperfect humans, we should allow similarly imperfect robots. The robots will get better. The humans, in aggregate, will not.
      - vhcr 1y ago
        Humans on the aggregate can definitely get better, that's why Norway has 2.14 / 100k traffic-related deaths per year and the United States has 12.84 / 100k.
        smallmancontrov 1y ago
        Norwegians drive half as much. Even if we ignore the other components of the gap, closing that 50% will require rebuilding 300000 square km of urban sprawl into dense urban centers with good public transit. It's a nice thought, but my money is on the robots.
        timeon 1y ago
        Robots are not going to fix other problems with sprawl. People there are focusing on wrong solutions.
        smallmancontrov 1y ago
        The "human drivers are shit" problem kills a million people every year. Solving it is good. If we let the great be the enemy of the good we will never fix anything.
  - int_19h 1y ago
    It's not a binary. That particular case is pretty egregious since the car signals to turn, gets into the turn lane, actually starts turning, and then swerves back (across the oncoming traffic lanes in the middle of an intersection!) and tries to get back into the correct lane to drive straight, but only manages to achieve that after driving for a bit in the lane for oncoming traffic. That is a major fuckup. And this all happens on a road with fresh clear marking, on a sunny day with perfect visibility.
djaychela 1y ago
They shouldn't be on the road either. That's not a positive argument for the Tesla experience, it's a negative one for whoever was driving that car.
- smallmancontrov 1y ago
  I don't like what that person did, but I don't think their license should be taken away for it.
  - djaychela 1y ago
    I believe that driving is a privilege, not a right. However, I'm not saying that their licence should be taken away (we've all made mistakes - I should have made that clear), but if that is representative, it is dangerous. I rode motorbikes for many years, and you can spot people who are dangerous very quickly from their 'car body language'. And an error like that in another circumstance could kill someone. I knew people whose driving had deteriorated like this (my late mother and her friends spring to mind). They refused to accept they were not capable any more, and she used to do things that terrified me. I had discussions (kindly!) about her driving standards and errors and she refused to accept that she was making the errors she was. And they were not as bad as what I saw in the video.

mahkeiro 1y ago

And so it’s ok to break traffic rules? In my country, as a human this will get you easily a one month license suspension.

smallmancontrov 1y ago
No, just a bit of perspective. I'm sure the video record of your car would be squeaky clean with no violations whatsoever.
- pixelpoet 1y ago
  If I said I've never had a driver's licence, can we get back to the topic at hand? What's the thesis here, humans are imperfect drivers and therefore we should accept self driving cars driving into incoming traffic, and if anyone objects, focus on their faults instead?
  - smallmancontrov 1y ago
    We allow imperfect humans, we should allow similarly imperfect robots. The robots will get better. The humans, in aggregate, will not.
    - vhcr 1y ago
      Humans on the aggregate can definitely get better, that's why Norway has 2.14 / 100k traffic-related deaths per year and the United States has 12.84 / 100k.
      - smallmancontrov 1y ago
        Norwegians drive half as much. Even if we ignore the other components of the gap, closing that 50% will require rebuilding 300000 square km of urban sprawl into dense urban centers with good public transit. It's a nice thought, but my money is on the robots.
        timeon 1y ago
        Robots are not going to fix other problems with sprawl. People there are focusing on wrong solutions.
        smallmancontrov 1y ago
        The "human drivers are shit" problem kills a million people every year. Solving it is good. If we let the great be the enemy of the good we will never fix anything.
- int_19h 1y ago
  It's not a binary. That particular case is pretty egregious since the car signals to turn, gets into the turn lane, actually starts turning, and then swerves back (across the oncoming traffic lanes in the middle of an intersection!) and tries to get back into the correct lane to drive straight, but only manages to achieve that after driving for a bit in the lane for oncoming traffic. That is a major fuckup. And this all happens on a road with fresh clear marking, on a sunny day with perfect visibility.

djaychela 1y ago

They shouldn't be on the road either. That's not a positive argument for the Tesla experience, it's a negative one for whoever was driving that car.

smallmancontrov 1y ago
I don't like what that person did, but I don't think their license should be taken away for it.
- djaychela 1y ago
  I believe that driving is a privilege, not a right. However, I'm not saying that their licence should be taken away (we've all made mistakes - I should have made that clear), but if that is representative, it is dangerous. I rode motorbikes for many years, and you can spot people who are dangerous very quickly from their 'car body language'. And an error like that in another circumstance could kill someone. I knew people whose driving had deteriorated like this (my late mother and her friends spring to mind). They refused to accept they were not capable any more, and she used to do things that terrified me. I had discussions (kindly!) about her driving standards and errors and she refused to accept that she was making the errors she was. And they were not as bad as what I saw in the video.