4 ms·

You say that like there is some inherent reason that it’s bad. Federal land belongs to you, to me, to all Americans. This land belongs our children. We’re selli

You say that like there is some inherent reason that it’s bad. Federal land belongs to you, to me, to all Americans. This land belongs our children. We’re selling it off to pay for tax cuts for the super wealthy.

wingspar 1y ago
Is it a travesty that 0.8% of New York is owned by the federal government? 80% is inherently too much.
- tokai 1y ago
  You have stated that twice now, but not explained why you think so.
- wwfn 1y ago
  .8% is a bit misleading. Public Land is 37% (as of 1991) [1] of the state. The ADK park is state owned/managed and huge. Catskill region also has lots of public land. They're both amazing places I'm happy don't look like the US side of Niagara falls [2] [1]: https://www.summitpost.org/public-and-private-land-percentages-by-us-states/186111#:~:text=62.5%25-,13,62.9%25,-14 https://www.summitpost.org/public-and-private-land-percentag... [2] https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_books/runte1/prologue.htm#:~:text=%22your%20niagara%20will%20have%20been%20spoiled%20for%20you.%20already%20the%20forest%20round%20about%20is%20being%20cleared...%20.%20i%20don't%20give%20the%20americans%20ten%20years%20to%20establish%20a%20saw%20or%20flour%20mill%20at%20the%20base%20of%20the%20cataract.%22 https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_books/runte1/prologue...
- plantwallshoe 1y ago
  Why?
- yongjik 1y ago
  New Amsterdam was founded on 1624, ~150 years before the federal government. You're comparing apples and oranges.
bigstrat2003 1y ago
> Federal land belongs to you, to me, to all Americans. So if it belongs to me, can I build a house there? Plant crops? Go hiking or camping? Can I do these things whenever I please without asking anyone? Because I wouldn't say "that land belongs to me" in any meaningful sense. National parks aside, I don't see how citizens benefit from the government owning large tracts of land.
- lukeschlather 1y ago
  Most national lands, you can in fact go hiking or camping there without asking anyone for permission. Some are permitted but only high-traffic areas. In the national forests for the most part you can literally pull over on the side of the road anywhere and camp.
- s1artibartfast 1y ago
  I'm a big fan of camping in federal lands. No permits like stupid state parks, just a 2 week limit on location. I like to 4x4 on old trails, pick a wild spot that looks good for camp, then break out the axe to find firewood. If you are not constrained by a vault toilet and pack your own water, it is a playground.
- evilduck 1y ago
  Planting and harvesting are managed activities to protect the local ecosystem but there are permits available for both activities. You are also free to go hiking and camping within the rules (distance requirements from roads and trails, wildfire management restrictions, stay limits to prevent lasting damage, etc) across the _vast_ majority of publicly owned lands. Even building structures can be done in specific circumstances with permits or leases. This is all such easily accessed information direct from NFS, NPS, and BLM government websites, it's impossible to not view your comment as written in bad faith. Public lands are broadly your lands to enjoy and use as they exist in their natural state, so long as you're not depriving others of the same access.
  - plantwallshoe 1y ago
    I would guess it wasn’t bad faith but rather pure ignorance from someone who doesn’t spend much time outdoors.
freedomben 1y ago
I'm strongly against this change, but saying that federal land belongs to us is also wrong. The vast majority of it is closed off to public access, and what they do allow us to use is almost always full months in advance and packed with people. Some of my favorite spots are now closed for various reasons and they will jack you up for trespassing worse than a private owner could. I'm a huge advocate of zero impact (or leave no trace) use, and it's very true that many people will trash stuff, but it's definitely not my land whatsoever. We should be expanding public access, not selling it off

wingspar 1y ago

Is it a travesty that 0.8% of New York is owned by the federal government? 80% is inherently too much.

tokai 1y ago
You have stated that twice now, but not explained why you think so.
wwfn 1y ago
.8% is a bit misleading. Public Land is 37% (as of 1991) [1] of the state. The ADK park is state owned/managed and huge. Catskill region also has lots of public land. They're both amazing places I'm happy don't look like the US side of Niagara falls [2] [1]: https://www.summitpost.org/public-and-private-land-percentages-by-us-states/186111#:~:text=62.5%25-,13,62.9%25,-14 https://www.summitpost.org/public-and-private-land-percentag... [2] https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_books/runte1/prologue.htm#:~:text=%22your%20niagara%20will%20have%20been%20spoiled%20for%20you.%20already%20the%20forest%20round%20about%20is%20being%20cleared...%20.%20i%20don't%20give%20the%20americans%20ten%20years%20to%20establish%20a%20saw%20or%20flour%20mill%20at%20the%20base%20of%20the%20cataract.%22 https://www.nps.gov/parkhistory/online_books/runte1/prologue...
plantwallshoe 1y ago
Why?
yongjik 1y ago
New Amsterdam was founded on 1624, ~150 years before the federal government. You're comparing apples and oranges.

bigstrat2003 1y ago

> Federal land belongs to you, to me, to all Americans. So if it belongs to me, can I build a house there? Plant crops? Go hiking or camping? Can I do these things whenever I please without asking anyone? Because I wouldn't say "that land belongs to me" in any meaningful sense. National parks aside, I don't see how citizens benefit from the government owning large tracts of land.

lukeschlather 1y ago
Most national lands, you can in fact go hiking or camping there without asking anyone for permission. Some are permitted but only high-traffic areas. In the national forests for the most part you can literally pull over on the side of the road anywhere and camp.
s1artibartfast 1y ago
I'm a big fan of camping in federal lands. No permits like stupid state parks, just a 2 week limit on location. I like to 4x4 on old trails, pick a wild spot that looks good for camp, then break out the axe to find firewood. If you are not constrained by a vault toilet and pack your own water, it is a playground.
evilduck 1y ago
Planting and harvesting are managed activities to protect the local ecosystem but there are permits available for both activities. You are also free to go hiking and camping within the rules (distance requirements from roads and trails, wildfire management restrictions, stay limits to prevent lasting damage, etc) across the _vast_ majority of publicly owned lands. Even building structures can be done in specific circumstances with permits or leases. This is all such easily accessed information direct from NFS, NPS, and BLM government websites, it's impossible to not view your comment as written in bad faith. Public lands are broadly your lands to enjoy and use as they exist in their natural state, so long as you're not depriving others of the same access.
- plantwallshoe 1y ago
  I would guess it wasn’t bad faith but rather pure ignorance from someone who doesn’t spend much time outdoors.

freedomben 1y ago

I'm strongly against this change, but saying that federal land belongs to us is also wrong. The vast majority of it is closed off to public access, and what they do allow us to use is almost always full months in advance and packed with people. Some of my favorite spots are now closed for various reasons and they will jack you up for trespassing worse than a private owner could. I'm a huge advocate of zero impact (or leave no trace) use, and it's very true that many people will trash stuff, but it's definitely not my land whatsoever. We should be expanding public access, not selling it off