3 ms·
Having read the post mortem, I disagree. Slack engineers did something dumb, under pressure during an outage. Even if they hadn't, they still would have been
by marcusb 1y ago
Having read the post mortem, I disagree. Slack engineers did something dumb, under pressure during an outage. Even if they hadn't, they still would have been in a degraded state until they could properly remove their DNSSEC records and/or get the Route53 bug they hit fixed. In other words, they still would have had a 24+ hour outage, albeit with a smaller blast radius.
The design of DNSSEC is simply not fit for purpose for zone operators. It is far too easy to screw your zone up for far too marginal a benefit, to say nothing of the huge increase in CPU resource required to authenticate DNSSEC record chains.
The story for implementers is just as bad - the specifications are baroque, filled with lousy crypto and poorly thought-out options.
To give just one example, consider the NSEC3 iteration limit field. NSEC3 itself was designed mostly[0] to prevent zone enumeration when validating negative responses (which is trivial to perform with NSEC.) The iteration count was designed to give zone operators the ability to increase the cost to an attacker of generating a dictionary of nsec3 names[1]. Of course, a high iteration count also raises the cost to a non-malicious resolver of validating a negative response for a nsec3-enabled zone.
In good old DNSSEC fashion, the iterations field is a single number that is subject to a... wide variety of potential limits:
* 16 bits by the wire protocol
* 150 for 1,024 bit keys (RFC 5155 10.3[2])
* 500 for 2,048 bit keys (RFC 5155 10.3[2])
* 2,500 for 4,096 bit keys (RFC 5155 10.3[2])
* 0 (RFC 9276 3.2)
Why 0? It was noted -- after publishing the NSEC3 spec -- that high iterations just don't provide that much benefit, and come with a high cost to throughput. Appendix B of RFC 9276 shows a roughly 50% performance degradation with an iteration count of 100. So, RFC 9276 3.2 says:
Validating resolvers MAY also return a SERVFAIL response when processing NSEC3 records with iterations larger than 0.
Of course, their guidance to implementers is to set the limits a bit higher, returning insecure responses at 100 iterations and SERVFAIL at 500. That said, if you want to be maximally interoperable, as a zone operator, you should pretend like the iteration count field doesn't exist: it is standards compliant for a validating resolver to refuse an nsec3 response with more than a single hash round.
As I said, this is one example, but I'm not cherry picking here. The whole of the DNSSEC spec corpus is filled with incomprehensible verbiage and opportunities for conflicting interpretations, far beyond what you see in most protocol specs.
0 - also to reduce the size of signed top-level zones
1 - all NSEC and NSEC3 records, while responsive to queries about names that don't exist, consist of obfuscated names that do exist.
2 - According to the letter of the standard, the limits applied to the iterations field should be 149, 499, and 2,499. Implementations are inconsistent about this.
- teddyh 1y agoIIUC, if Slack had done the correct thing, only wildcard DNS records (if any) would have been affected. They would certainly not have had a complete DNS blackout. I would classify that as significant. > The story for implementers is just as bad - the specifications are baroque, filled with lousy crypto and poorly thought-out options. I don’t care. So is almost every other standard, but until something better comes along, DNSSEC is what we have. Arguing that a working and implemented solution should not be used since it is worse than a non-existing theoretical perfect solution is both: 1. True 2. Completely and utterly useless, except as a way to waste everyone’s time and drain their energy.
- marcusb 1y ago> IIUC, if Slack had done the correct thing, only wildcard DNS records (if any) would have been affected There's the problem - you DON'T understand. Straight from the post-portem that you clearly have not read: One microsecond later, app.slack.com fails to resolve with a ‘ERR_NAME_NOT_RESOLVED’ error: [screenshot of error ] This indicated there was likely a problem with the ‘*.slack.com’ wildcard record since we didn’t have a wildcard record in any of the other domains where we had rolled out DNSSEC on. Yes, it was an oversight that we did not test a domain with a wildcard record before attempting slack.com — learn from our mistakes! > I don’t care. So is almost every other standard, Cool story. I do care. I'd like to see greater protection of the DNS infrastructure. DNSSEC adoption is hovering around 4%. TLS for HTTP is around 90%. At least part of that discrepancy is due to how broken DNSSEC is.
- teddyh 1y agoThey could have done a quick fix by adding an explicit app.slack.com record. But instead they removed the DNSSEC signing from the whole domain, thereby invalidating all records, not just the wildcard ones. > I do care. I will care once something else comes around with any promise of being implemented and rolled out. Until then, I see no need to discourage the adoption of DNSSEC, or disparage its design, except when designing its newer version or replacement. > I'd like to see greater protection of the DNS infrastructure. DNSSEC adoption is hovering around 4%. I work at a registrar and DNS hosting provider for more than 10.000 domains. More than 70% of them have DNSSEC.