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> I'm not affiliated with the rationalist community, but I always interpreted "Less Wrong" as word-play on how "being right" is an absolute binary: you can eith

by the_af 1y ago

> I'm not affiliated with the rationalist community, but I always interpreted "Less Wrong" as word-play on how "being right" is an absolute binary: you can either be right, nor not be right, while "being wrong" can cover a very large gradient. I know that's what they mean at the surface level, but you just know it comes with a high degree of smugness and false modesty. "I only know that I know nothing" -- maybe, but they ain't no modern day Socrates, they are just a bunch of nerds going online with their thoughts.

Matticus_Rex 1y ago
So much projection.
- the_af 1y ago
  I don't think I'm more clever than the average person, nor have I made this my identity or created a whole tribe around it, nor do I attend nor host conferences around my cleverness, rationality, or weird sexual fetishes. In other words: no.
  - JamesBarney 1y ago
    Rationalism is not about trying to be clever it's very much about trying to be a little less wrong. Most people are not even trying, which includes myself. I don't write down my predictions, I don't keep a list of my errors. I just show up to work like everyone else and don't worry about it. I really don't understand all the claims that they intellectually smug and overconfident when they are the one group of people trying to do better. It really seems like all the hatred is aimed at the hubris to even try to do better.
mariusor 1y ago
Sometimes people enjoy being clever not because they want to rub it in your face that you're not, but because it's fun. I usually try not to take it personally when I don't get the joke and strive to do better next time.
- the_af 1y ago
  That's mildly insulting of you. I do get the joke; I think it's an instance of their feelings of "rational" superiority. Assuming the other person didn't get the joke is very... irrational of you.
  - mariusor 1y ago
    Like I said, I'm not trying to be a rationalist, or at least not this flavour of it. That being said, I apologise for the dig.
zahlman 1y ago
>but you just know it comes with a high degree of smugness and false modesty No; I know no such thing, as I have no good reason to believe it, and plenty of countering evidence.
- astrange 1y ago
  Very rational of you, but that's the problem with the whole system. If you want to avoid thinking you're right all the time, it doesn't help to be clever and say the logical opposite. "Rationally" it should work, but it's bad because you're still thinking about it! It's like the thinking of a pink elephant thing. Other approaches I recommend: * try and fail to invest in stocks * read Meaningness's https://metarationality.com https://metarationality.com * print out this meme and put it on your wall https://imgflip.com/i/82h43h https://imgflip.com/i/82h43h
  - zahlman 1y ago
    >If you want to avoid thinking you're right all the time, it doesn't help to be clever and say the logical opposite. I don't understand how this is supposed to be relevant here. You seem to be falsely accusing me of doing such a thing, or of being motivated by simple contrarianism. Again, your claim was: > but you just know it comes with a high degree of smugness and false modesty Why should I "just know" any such thing? What is your reason for "just knowing" it? It comes across that you have simply decided to assume the worst of people that you don't understand.
    - the_af 1y ago
      It was my claim, not the person you're responding to now. As to why I "just know": it's because I'm not a robot, I have experience at reading this kind of claims, and they usually mean what I think they mean. "You just know" is an idiomatic expression, it's not meant to be dissected.

by the_af 1y ago

Matticus_Rex 1y ago

So much projection.

the_af 1y ago
I don't think I'm more clever than the average person, nor have I made this my identity or created a whole tribe around it, nor do I attend nor host conferences around my cleverness, rationality, or weird sexual fetishes. In other words: no.
- JamesBarney 1y ago
  Rationalism is not about trying to be clever it's very much about trying to be a little less wrong. Most people are not even trying, which includes myself. I don't write down my predictions, I don't keep a list of my errors. I just show up to work like everyone else and don't worry about it. I really don't understand all the claims that they intellectually smug and overconfident when they are the one group of people trying to do better. It really seems like all the hatred is aimed at the hubris to even try to do better.

mariusor 1y ago

Sometimes people enjoy being clever not because they want to rub it in your face that you're not, but because it's fun. I usually try not to take it personally when I don't get the joke and strive to do better next time.

the_af 1y ago
That's mildly insulting of you. I do get the joke; I think it's an instance of their feelings of "rational" superiority. Assuming the other person didn't get the joke is very... irrational of you.
- mariusor 1y ago
  Like I said, I'm not trying to be a rationalist, or at least not this flavour of it. That being said, I apologise for the dig.

zahlman 1y ago

>but you just know it comes with a high degree of smugness and false modesty No; I know no such thing, as I have no good reason to believe it, and plenty of countering evidence.

astrange 1y ago
Very rational of you, but that's the problem with the whole system. If you want to avoid thinking you're right all the time, it doesn't help to be clever and say the logical opposite. "Rationally" it should work, but it's bad because you're still thinking about it! It's like the thinking of a pink elephant thing. Other approaches I recommend: * try and fail to invest in stocks * read Meaningness's https://metarationality.com https://metarationality.com * print out this meme and put it on your wall https://imgflip.com/i/82h43h https://imgflip.com/i/82h43h
- zahlman 1y ago
  >If you want to avoid thinking you're right all the time, it doesn't help to be clever and say the logical opposite. I don't understand how this is supposed to be relevant here. You seem to be falsely accusing me of doing such a thing, or of being motivated by simple contrarianism. Again, your claim was: > but you just know it comes with a high degree of smugness and false modesty Why should I "just know" any such thing? What is your reason for "just knowing" it? It comes across that you have simply decided to assume the worst of people that you don't understand.
  - the_af 1y ago
    It was my claim, not the person you're responding to now. As to why I "just know": it's because I'm not a robot, I have experience at reading this kind of claims, and they usually mean what I think they mean. "You just know" is an idiomatic expression, it's not meant to be dissected.