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I'd like to hear from Linux kernel developers. There is no significant software that has been written (plagiarized) by "AI". Why not ask the actual experts who

I'd like to hear from Linux kernel developers. There is no significant software that has been written (plagiarized) by "AI". Why not ask the actual experts who deliver instead of talk? This whole thing is a religion.

diggan 1y ago
What counts as "significant software"? Only kernels I guess?
- xvilka 1y ago
  Office software, CAD systems, Web Browsers, the list is long.
  - diggan 1y ago
    Microsoft (famously developing somewhat popular office-like software) seems to be going in the direction of almost forcing developers to use LLMs to assist with coding, at least going by what people are willing to admit publicly and seeing some GitHub activity. Google (made a small browser or something) also develops their own models, I don't think it's far fetched to imagine there is at least one developer on the Chrome/Chromium team that is trying to dogfood that stuff. As for Autodesk, I have no idea what they're up to, but corporate IT seems hellbent on killing themselves, not sure Autodesk would do anything differently so they're probably also trying to jam LLMs down their employees throats.
    - bgwalter 1y ago
      Microsoft is also selling "AI", so they want headlines like "30% of our code is written by AI". So they force open source developers to babysit the tools and suffer. It's also an advertisement for potential "AI" military applications that they undoubtedly propose after the HoloLens failure: https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/13/23402195/microsoft-us-army-hololens-ar-goggles-internal-reports-failings-nausea-headaches https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/13/23402195/microsoft-us-ar... The HoloLens failure is a great example of overhyped technology, just like the bunker busters that are now in the headlines for overpromising.
    - e3bc54b2 1y ago
      'forcing' anybody to do anything means they don't like doing it, usually because it causes them more work or headache or discomfort. You know, the exact opposite of what AI providers are claiming it does.
    - sensanaty 1y ago
      > Microsoft https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44050152 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44050152 Very impressive indeed, not a single line of any quality to be found despite them forcing it on people.
      - diggan 1y ago
        Lets not change the goalpost, parent asked for any examples of software written with LLMs, and regardless if the output is quality or not, that is one example. Besides, Microsoft isn't really known for their high code quality, so I'm not even sure using even dumb LLMs/tools like Copilot would actually have a negative effect.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
- rwmj 1y ago
  Can you point to any significant open source software that has any kind of significant AI contributions? As an actual open source developer I'm not seeing anything. I am getting bogus pull requests full of AI slop that are causing problems though.
  - diggan 1y ago
    > Can you point to any significant open source software that has any kind of significant AI contributions? No, but I haven't looked. Can you? As an actual open source developer too, I do get some value from replacing search engine usage with LLMs that can do the searching and collation for me, as long as they have references I can use for diving deeper, they certainly accelerate my own workflow. But I don't do "vibe-coding" or use any LLM-connected editors, just my own written software that is mostly various CLIs and chat-like UIs.
mellosouls 1y ago
There is no significant software that has been written (plagiarized) by "AI". How do you know? As you haven't evidenced your claim, you could start by providing explicit examples of what is significant. Even if you are correct, the amount of llm-assisted code is increasing all the time, and we are still only a couple of years in - give it time. Why not ask the actual experts Many would regard Karpathy in the expert category I think?
- rwmj 1y ago
  The AI people are the ones making the extraordinary claims here.
- bgwalter 1y ago
  I think you should not turn things around here. Up to 2021 we had a vibrant software environment that obviously had zero "AI" input. It has made companies and some developers filthy rich. Since "AI" became a religion, it is used as an excuse for layoffs while no serious software is written by "AI". The "AI" people are making the claims. Since they invading a functioning software environment, it is their responsibility to back up their claims.
  - TeMPOraL 1y ago
    Still wonder what your definition of "serious software" is. I kinda concur - I consider most of the webshit to be not serious, but then, this is where software industry makes bulk of its profits, and that space is absolutely being eaten by agentic coding, right now, today. So if we s/serious/money-making/, you are wrong - or at least about to be proven, as these things enter prod and are talked about.
bytefish 1y ago
Microsoft is dogfooding Copilot in their dotnet/runtime [1] and dotnet/aspnetcore [2] repositories. This is the only time I have seen a company using its own AI Tools transparently. Yes, they label it an experiment, but I am pretty sure it’s mandated use within Microsoft. I am an “AI skeptic”, so clearly I am biased here. What I am seeing in the repositories is, that Copilot hasn’t made any substantial contributions so far. The PRs, that went through? They often contain very, very detailed feedback, up to the point line by line replacements have been suggested. The same engineers, that went up stage at “Microsoft Build 2025” to tell how amazing Copilot is and how it made them a 100x developer? They are not using Copilot in any of their PRs. You said it’s a religion. I’d say it’s a cult. Whatever it is, outside the distortion bubble, this whole thing looks pretty bad to me. [1] https://github.com/dotnet/runtime/pulls https://github.com/dotnet/runtime/pulls [2] https://github.com/dotnet/aspnetcore/pulls https://github.com/dotnet/aspnetcore/pulls

diggan 1y ago

What counts as "significant software"? Only kernels I guess?

xvilka 1y ago
Office software, CAD systems, Web Browsers, the list is long.
- diggan 1y ago
  Microsoft (famously developing somewhat popular office-like software) seems to be going in the direction of almost forcing developers to use LLMs to assist with coding, at least going by what people are willing to admit publicly and seeing some GitHub activity. Google (made a small browser or something) also develops their own models, I don't think it's far fetched to imagine there is at least one developer on the Chrome/Chromium team that is trying to dogfood that stuff. As for Autodesk, I have no idea what they're up to, but corporate IT seems hellbent on killing themselves, not sure Autodesk would do anything differently so they're probably also trying to jam LLMs down their employees throats.
  - bgwalter 1y ago
    Microsoft is also selling "AI", so they want headlines like "30% of our code is written by AI". So they force open source developers to babysit the tools and suffer. It's also an advertisement for potential "AI" military applications that they undoubtedly propose after the HoloLens failure: https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/13/23402195/microsoft-us-army-hololens-ar-goggles-internal-reports-failings-nausea-headaches https://www.theverge.com/2022/10/13/23402195/microsoft-us-ar... The HoloLens failure is a great example of overhyped technology, just like the bunker busters that are now in the headlines for overpromising.
  - e3bc54b2 1y ago
    'forcing' anybody to do anything means they don't like doing it, usually because it causes them more work or headache or discomfort. You know, the exact opposite of what AI providers are claiming it does.
  - sensanaty 1y ago
    > Microsoft https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44050152 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44050152 Very impressive indeed, not a single line of any quality to be found despite them forcing it on people.
    - diggan 1y ago
      Lets not change the goalpost, parent asked for any examples of software written with LLMs, and regardless if the output is quality or not, that is one example. Besides, Microsoft isn't really known for their high code quality, so I'm not even sure using even dumb LLMs/tools like Copilot would actually have a negative effect.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
rwmj 1y ago
Can you point to any significant open source software that has any kind of significant AI contributions? As an actual open source developer I'm not seeing anything. I am getting bogus pull requests full of AI slop that are causing problems though.
- diggan 1y ago
  > Can you point to any significant open source software that has any kind of significant AI contributions? No, but I haven't looked. Can you? As an actual open source developer too, I do get some value from replacing search engine usage with LLMs that can do the searching and collation for me, as long as they have references I can use for diving deeper, they certainly accelerate my own workflow. But I don't do "vibe-coding" or use any LLM-connected editors, just my own written software that is mostly various CLIs and chat-like UIs.

mellosouls 1y ago

There is no significant software that has been written (plagiarized) by "AI". How do you know? As you haven't evidenced your claim, you could start by providing explicit examples of what is significant. Even if you are correct, the amount of llm-assisted code is increasing all the time, and we are still only a couple of years in - give it time. Why not ask the actual experts Many would regard Karpathy in the expert category I think?

rwmj 1y ago
The AI people are the ones making the extraordinary claims here.
bgwalter 1y ago
I think you should not turn things around here. Up to 2021 we had a vibrant software environment that obviously had zero "AI" input. It has made companies and some developers filthy rich. Since "AI" became a religion, it is used as an excuse for layoffs while no serious software is written by "AI". The "AI" people are making the claims. Since they invading a functioning software environment, it is their responsibility to back up their claims.
- TeMPOraL 1y ago
  Still wonder what your definition of "serious software" is. I kinda concur - I consider most of the webshit to be not serious, but then, this is where software industry makes bulk of its profits, and that space is absolutely being eaten by agentic coding, right now, today. So if we s/serious/money-making/, you are wrong - or at least about to be proven, as these things enter prod and are talked about.

bytefish 1y ago

Microsoft is dogfooding Copilot in their dotnet/runtime [1] and dotnet/aspnetcore [2] repositories. This is the only time I have seen a company using its own AI Tools transparently. Yes, they label it an experiment, but I am pretty sure it’s mandated use within Microsoft. I am an “AI skeptic”, so clearly I am biased here. What I am seeing in the repositories is, that Copilot hasn’t made any substantial contributions so far. The PRs, that went through? They often contain very, very detailed feedback, up to the point line by line replacements have been suggested. The same engineers, that went up stage at “Microsoft Build 2025” to tell how amazing Copilot is and how it made them a 100x developer? They are not using Copilot in any of their PRs. You said it’s a religion. I’d say it’s a cult. Whatever it is, outside the distortion bubble, this whole thing looks pretty bad to me. [1] https://github.com/dotnet/runtime/pulls https://github.com/dotnet/runtime/pulls [2] https://github.com/dotnet/aspnetcore/pulls https://github.com/dotnet/aspnetcore/pulls