7 ms·

Firefox is dead to me – and I'm not the only one who is fed up

65 points by ofrzeta 1y ago

ofrzeta 1y ago
Still currently Firefox is the best option we have, don't we? In terms of compatability and features anyway. For years working as a full-stack developer I stubbornly sticked to Firefox and it has served me well.
- squircle 1y ago
  I work across the stack but necessarily use the browsers end users are working with. Also, I can't pay my fecking credit card on Linux or any browser other than Edge. Whatever tho. A hammer is a hammer.
  - CrankyBear 1y ago
    Ah... I use Chrome on Linux, and it works just fine for banks and credit cards.
    - fortyseven 1y ago
      Same. It's exceptionally rare for Firefox to fail me and force me to use a different browser. I'm when it does happen, it's either a Chrome specific feature, or a failure of the developer.
      - freedomben 1y ago
        It's not (just) Firefox to blame. It's ramp.com, mailgun, and these other big apps that don't bother testing on Firefox. You can't even login on these
        yesweb 1y ago
        [dead]
  - dv_dt 1y ago
    Not being able to use Firefox for banking or finance is something that hasn't happened to me in years. When it did happen, it was usually fixed with a simple workaround of sending a custom user agent string.
    - guenthert 1y ago
      I think e.g. Capital One is using Wasm, yuck. That needs to be enabled (it is by default in Firefox).
- dlcarrier 1y ago
  Yeah, outside of Chromium forks the only other option is Gecko-based browsers. I use Seamonkey and Palemoon, to avoid the Mozilla Foundation's shenanigans. The performance isn't great, and I have to occasionally restart anything running on the Gecko engine, althogh the latter is also true for Chromium forks.
nottorp 1y ago
Show me another browser that still runs uBlock Origin. Other browsers may be less resource intensive but with unreadable internet.
- ziml77 1y ago
  I was using a Chromium-based browser for a bit until I looked into how forks are handling the Mv3 changeover. Seems none them are willing to maintain Mv2 support. A couple of them claim it's fine because they have ad blocking built into the browser, but I know from experience none of them work as well as uBO. So, I switched back to Firefox where I'm plenty happy.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - tcfhgj 1y ago
    you are like me
  - raxxorraxor 1y ago
    Mozilla should rebrand Mv2 to SuperM or something like that. People that believe Mv3 is as powerful are simply wrong. Also malicious browser plugins weren't a sensible threat for years now. Of course this is about making browsers less customizable, Googles wet dream of web integrity. Integrity with ads, ads, ads... The security argument is so perverted in this instance, although that also didn't stop mobile OS from being majorly shitty until you install an ssh client.
- devmor 1y ago
  Not just unreadable - actively malicious. Every now and then I run into a website with a bunch of custom javascript that doesn't function in Firefox, and I'll have to open up Edge or Chromium (depending on what computer I'm using). Every time this happens, I'm immediately accosted with "features" or advertisements attempting to hijack my experience to sell me something or steal from me. As long as Firefox supports the tools that protect me from the hostile behavior of websites, it will remain my browser of choice.
yamapikarya 1y ago
i like brave. it just works
- guywithahat 1y ago
  I also like Brave. Great all around experience
- anonbanker 1y ago
  It's really depressing that you've been downvoted to grey. People don't even have coherent reasons to dislike the browser.
  - em-bee 1y ago
    i don't use brave because it is based on chromium. i upvoted the comment anyways.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
mrkramer 1y ago
I guess complaints are aimed at Firefox's desktop browser but mobile Firefox browser is pretty good and they are the only mobile browser that I know of that supports third party extensions. That fact by itself should be a killer app for Firefox mobile browser.
- wand3r 1y ago
  Yeah, understandable. The problem for me is the desktop app sucks. I need both for browsing sync, passwords and adblock and 3rd party search. Brave works best for me on Mac and iPhone. Most of the extensions I would use are built in, but I dont think it fully supports 3rd party extensions. I am not sure, is that possible on iPhone?
- vunderba 1y ago
  Orion (which I believe is made by the same people that developed the Kagi search engine) supports both Firefox and Chrome extensions though it's still at the experimental stage. More importantly, I believe firefox on iOS is still backed by WebKit and thus does not support regular extensions either.
- illiac786 1y ago
  On iOS everyone is still stuck on WebKit. Also EU seems to be bringing light at the end of the tunnel on this one. Like with alternate stores, alternate NFC payment, alternate standard apps, etc. EU is seriously amazing on this, in my view.
  - msgodel 1y ago
    Normally I don't like governments stepping in for this sort of thing but good fucking God Apple has been such a poor steward of their platform that it's actually creating problems even for people who don't use it. This is one of those situations where it really is necessary.
    - illiac786 1y ago
      Considering that this platform exists since what, over 10 years, I think the EU gave them a fair amount of time to get their shit together. By now, it's clear they won't or do not want to, hence EU stepping in. I hate over-regulation, especially made by people that have no clue about the market they are regulating, but as you said, I think in this case it's more than warranted.
bigbadfeline 1y ago
Firefox has its problems but it's the least bad of all, and I've tried them all. Chromium-based browsers are a non-starter, Brave messed up that one big time. On the other hand, Firefox-derived browsers are used by VPNs that know how to do web privacy and security - this is the way, get Firefox, configure it properly, make a few minor changes and give your users a better option.
ahartmetz 1y ago
Firefox is fine, what are they on about? I'm not going to switch to Chrome because Firefox is a few percent away from perfect. Firefox desktop recently added tab groups and it's a fantastic feature.
- m463 1y ago
  It phones home, a lot, from the moment you install it. It has plenty of connections to google too. The good thing is that the source code is mostly* out there and you or someone else can figure out what it's doing. [*] don't know about drm stuff
  - ahartmetz 1y ago
    What does it phone home about?
    - baobun 1y ago
      Everyone asking this should MitM their own browser and take a look into the requests. Eye-opening and pretty straightforward with e.g. mitmproxy. Strip TLS with a temporarily trusted self-signed cert to get the whole picture.
  - gxnxcxcx 1y ago
    There's shady shenanigans from the moment you download the Firefox installer, before you even install it. Each Firefox download has a unique identifier (2022): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30715163 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30715163
DamnInteresting 1y ago
I completely disagree. For me, Firefox is the best current browser on the whole, and in recent years I've moved most of my work and play away from Chrome, Arc, Safari, etc. in favor of Firefox. It has retained support for Manifest v2, which is huge for me. The Chrome maintainers seem hellbent on cultivating the web into an ad-addled hellscape.
- butshouldyou 1y ago
  Firefox would have to be seriously broken for me to consider moving away. Chromium's lack of ad blocker support is a deal breaker.
em-bee 1y ago
mozilla has tried many projects over the years. i don't remember any that survived. so i'll wait an see whether they manage to ruin firefox with AI before i switch. until then firefox is still better than chromium/chrome. and even then unfortunately if we don't have a choice. if firefox dies the result will be a chromium based monoculture. that's not healthy. firefox may be the worst browser except for all the others. let's see if ladybird gets any traction and manages to keep its funding continuously. but they are still a year or two away from being able to even compete with firefox and chrome.
jkmcf 1y ago
Firefox is living on for me as Zen: https://zen-browser.app/ https://zen-browser.app/
richij 1y ago
And Thunderbird is dead to me

65 points by ofrzeta 1y ago

Still currently Firefox is the best option we have, don't we? In terms of compatability and features anyway. For years working as a full-stack developer I stubbornly sticked to Firefox and it has served me well.

squircle 1y ago
I work across the stack but necessarily use the browsers end users are working with. Also, I can't pay my fecking credit card on Linux or any browser other than Edge. Whatever tho. A hammer is a hammer.
- CrankyBear 1y ago
  Ah... I use Chrome on Linux, and it works just fine for banks and credit cards.
  - fortyseven 1y ago
    Same. It's exceptionally rare for Firefox to fail me and force me to use a different browser. I'm when it does happen, it's either a Chrome specific feature, or a failure of the developer.
    - freedomben 1y ago
      It's not (just) Firefox to blame. It's ramp.com, mailgun, and these other big apps that don't bother testing on Firefox. You can't even login on these
      - yesweb 1y ago
        [dead]
- dv_dt 1y ago
  Not being able to use Firefox for banking or finance is something that hasn't happened to me in years. When it did happen, it was usually fixed with a simple workaround of sending a custom user agent string.
  - guenthert 1y ago
    I think e.g. Capital One is using Wasm, yuck. That needs to be enabled (it is by default in Firefox).
dlcarrier 1y ago
Yeah, outside of Chromium forks the only other option is Gecko-based browsers. I use Seamonkey and Palemoon, to avoid the Mozilla Foundation's shenanigans. The performance isn't great, and I have to occasionally restart anything running on the Gecko engine, althogh the latter is also true for Chromium forks.

nottorp 1y ago

Show me another browser that still runs uBlock Origin. Other browsers may be less resource intensive but with unreadable internet.

ziml77 1y ago
I was using a Chromium-based browser for a bit until I looked into how forks are handling the Mv3 changeover. Seems none them are willing to maintain Mv2 support. A couple of them claim it's fine because they have ad blocking built into the browser, but I know from experience none of them work as well as uBO. So, I switched back to Firefox where I'm plenty happy.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- tcfhgj 1y ago
  you are like me
- raxxorraxor 1y ago
  Mozilla should rebrand Mv2 to SuperM or something like that. People that believe Mv3 is as powerful are simply wrong. Also malicious browser plugins weren't a sensible threat for years now. Of course this is about making browsers less customizable, Googles wet dream of web integrity. Integrity with ads, ads, ads... The security argument is so perverted in this instance, although that also didn't stop mobile OS from being majorly shitty until you install an ssh client.
devmor 1y ago
Not just unreadable - actively malicious. Every now and then I run into a website with a bunch of custom javascript that doesn't function in Firefox, and I'll have to open up Edge or Chromium (depending on what computer I'm using). Every time this happens, I'm immediately accosted with "features" or advertisements attempting to hijack my experience to sell me something or steal from me. As long as Firefox supports the tools that protect me from the hostile behavior of websites, it will remain my browser of choice.

yamapikarya 1y ago

i like brave. it just works

guywithahat 1y ago
I also like Brave. Great all around experience
anonbanker 1y ago
It's really depressing that you've been downvoted to grey. People don't even have coherent reasons to dislike the browser.
- em-bee 1y ago
  i don't use brave because it is based on chromium. i upvoted the comment anyways.

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

mrkramer 1y ago

I guess complaints are aimed at Firefox's desktop browser but mobile Firefox browser is pretty good and they are the only mobile browser that I know of that supports third party extensions. That fact by itself should be a killer app for Firefox mobile browser.

wand3r 1y ago
Yeah, understandable. The problem for me is the desktop app sucks. I need both for browsing sync, passwords and adblock and 3rd party search. Brave works best for me on Mac and iPhone. Most of the extensions I would use are built in, but I dont think it fully supports 3rd party extensions. I am not sure, is that possible on iPhone?
vunderba 1y ago
Orion (which I believe is made by the same people that developed the Kagi search engine) supports both Firefox and Chrome extensions though it's still at the experimental stage. More importantly, I believe firefox on iOS is still backed by WebKit and thus does not support regular extensions either.
illiac786 1y ago
On iOS everyone is still stuck on WebKit. Also EU seems to be bringing light at the end of the tunnel on this one. Like with alternate stores, alternate NFC payment, alternate standard apps, etc. EU is seriously amazing on this, in my view.
- msgodel 1y ago
  Normally I don't like governments stepping in for this sort of thing but good fucking God Apple has been such a poor steward of their platform that it's actually creating problems even for people who don't use it. This is one of those situations where it really is necessary.
  - illiac786 1y ago
    Considering that this platform exists since what, over 10 years, I think the EU gave them a fair amount of time to get their shit together. By now, it's clear they won't or do not want to, hence EU stepping in. I hate over-regulation, especially made by people that have no clue about the market they are regulating, but as you said, I think in this case it's more than warranted.

bigbadfeline 1y ago

Firefox has its problems but it's the least bad of all, and I've tried them all. Chromium-based browsers are a non-starter, Brave messed up that one big time. On the other hand, Firefox-derived browsers are used by VPNs that know how to do web privacy and security - this is the way, get Firefox, configure it properly, make a few minor changes and give your users a better option.

ahartmetz 1y ago

Firefox is fine, what are they on about? I'm not going to switch to Chrome because Firefox is a few percent away from perfect. Firefox desktop recently added tab groups and it's a fantastic feature.

m463 1y ago
It phones home, a lot, from the moment you install it. It has plenty of connections to google too. The good thing is that the source code is mostly* out there and you or someone else can figure out what it's doing. [*] don't know about drm stuff
- ahartmetz 1y ago
  What does it phone home about?
  - baobun 1y ago
    Everyone asking this should MitM their own browser and take a look into the requests. Eye-opening and pretty straightforward with e.g. mitmproxy. Strip TLS with a temporarily trusted self-signed cert to get the whole picture.
- gxnxcxcx 1y ago
  There's shady shenanigans from the moment you download the Firefox installer, before you even install it. Each Firefox download has a unique identifier (2022): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30715163 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30715163

DamnInteresting 1y ago

I completely disagree. For me, Firefox is the best current browser on the whole, and in recent years I've moved most of my work and play away from Chrome, Arc, Safari, etc. in favor of Firefox. It has retained support for Manifest v2, which is huge for me. The Chrome maintainers seem hellbent on cultivating the web into an ad-addled hellscape.

butshouldyou 1y ago
Firefox would have to be seriously broken for me to consider moving away. Chromium's lack of ad blocker support is a deal breaker.

em-bee 1y ago

mozilla has tried many projects over the years. i don't remember any that survived. so i'll wait an see whether they manage to ruin firefox with AI before i switch. until then firefox is still better than chromium/chrome. and even then unfortunately if we don't have a choice. if firefox dies the result will be a chromium based monoculture. that's not healthy. firefox may be the worst browser except for all the others. let's see if ladybird gets any traction and manages to keep its funding continuously. but they are still a year or two away from being able to even compete with firefox and chrome.

jkmcf 1y ago

Firefox is living on for me as Zen: https://zen-browser.app/ https://zen-browser.app/

richij 1y ago

And Thunderbird is dead to me