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Yes. The essay puts it this way: "Until such time as smartphones and social media can be democratically governed or nationalized — liberated from the imperativ

Yes. The essay puts it this way: "Until such time as smartphones and social media can be democratically governed or nationalized — liberated from the imperative to profit off our attention indefinitely — a ban may be the most realistic path to reclaiming our lives."

hagbard_c 1y ago
Right, so now the same people who have for decades been running all those government programs into the ground should get control over our pocket computers as well? No and no and no thanks either, just simply no. I am far better at controlling the thing than whatever the commissars at the state would be able to do. The real problem as said is advertising and all the 'social' (but really the opposite) guff around it so you won't find any of that on my devices. No Google, No MF-book, no nothin'. I run my own services on the server-under-the-stairs which are used by my family - daughters included - and am not waiting for the 'democratically governed' alternative which no doubt will insist on propagansiding whatever trendy nonsense is coming out of the social studies academies at the moment and will block the use of private servers 'to protect the vulnerable' or some such nonsense. Pocket computers - which these devices are - are useful and handy devices, just make sure not to pollute them with advertising and social nonsense and keep away from those data-hungry megacorpps and similar startup wannabees.
- eesmith 1y ago
  I'm pretty sure the writers at the Jacobin would say that the US is far from "democratic." If you don't need governance then of course it doesn't matter to you. Running your own services is not easy. Most people cannot. You cannot seriously think only those who can run their own services should be online. Who then should they trust?
Eddy_Viscosity2 1y ago
The problem here is that having a government body control your phone would also be bad - mostly because its just so much power that eventually a Musk will get himself in there and totally exploit it for all sorts of nefarious purposes. But the problem is equally that right now your phone is controlled by a group of unelected people who absolutely will throw your mental health and well-being under the bus for a few extra clicks and data points. I don't know how to solve this problem.
- eesmith 1y ago
  One place to start - we must all have the right to live off-line. This must apply broadly. There must be no need for an app for health care, parking, schools, transit, tolls, package delivery, hotels, restaurants, retirement, banking, and other things which 10 years ago had perfectly reasonable and affordable non-app access. This analog alternative must be reasonable. It can't be that non-app access is only available, for example, every fifth Monday of the month. If you think the unelected people who control your phone are doing the wrong thing, then you must be able to boycott them and still live a regular life, perhaps with a few more in-person visits than you expected. This right applies more broadly. I read about a blind man in France who wanted to take the train. The local station no longer had ticket service, not even a machine. The app didn't support blind people. He got on the train and ended up having to pay a fee as he had no valid ticket. A ticket machine, or the ability to pay onboard from staff when coming in from a station without a ticket machine, is a perfectly reasonable analog alternative.

hagbard_c 1y ago

Right, so now the same people who have for decades been running all those government programs into the ground should get control over our pocket computers as well? No and no and no thanks either, just simply no. I am far better at controlling the thing than whatever the commissars at the state would be able to do. The real problem as said is advertising and all the 'social' (but really the opposite) guff around it so you won't find any of that on my devices. No Google, No MF-book, no nothin'. I run my own services on the server-under-the-stairs which are used by my family - daughters included - and am not waiting for the 'democratically governed' alternative which no doubt will insist on propagansiding whatever trendy nonsense is coming out of the social studies academies at the moment and will block the use of private servers 'to protect the vulnerable' or some such nonsense. Pocket computers - which these devices are - are useful and handy devices, just make sure not to pollute them with advertising and social nonsense and keep away from those data-hungry megacorpps and similar startup wannabees.

eesmith 1y ago
I'm pretty sure the writers at the Jacobin would say that the US is far from "democratic." If you don't need governance then of course it doesn't matter to you. Running your own services is not easy. Most people cannot. You cannot seriously think only those who can run their own services should be online. Who then should they trust?

Eddy_Viscosity2 1y ago

The problem here is that having a government body control your phone would also be bad - mostly because its just so much power that eventually a Musk will get himself in there and totally exploit it for all sorts of nefarious purposes. But the problem is equally that right now your phone is controlled by a group of unelected people who absolutely will throw your mental health and well-being under the bus for a few extra clicks and data points. I don't know how to solve this problem.

eesmith 1y ago
One place to start - we must all have the right to live off-line. This must apply broadly. There must be no need for an app for health care, parking, schools, transit, tolls, package delivery, hotels, restaurants, retirement, banking, and other things which 10 years ago had perfectly reasonable and affordable non-app access. This analog alternative must be reasonable. It can't be that non-app access is only available, for example, every fifth Monday of the month. If you think the unelected people who control your phone are doing the wrong thing, then you must be able to boycott them and still live a regular life, perhaps with a few more in-person visits than you expected. This right applies more broadly. I read about a blind man in France who wanted to take the train. The local station no longer had ticket service, not even a machine. The app didn't support blind people. He got on the train and ended up having to pay a fee as he had no valid ticket. A ticket machine, or the ability to pay onboard from staff when coming in from a station without a ticket machine, is a perfectly reasonable analog alternative.