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Americans want looting and authoritarianism, so that’s what they’re getting. There’s no excuses here after a majority of people voted for Trump’s return, with h

Americans want looting and authoritarianism, so that’s what they’re getting. There’s no excuses here after a majority of people voted for Trump’s return, with his repeated promises that he wouldn’t be held back this time around. We got exactly what we voted for — worldwide tariffs, sending the military to round up migrants, a military parade with tanks in DC, antivax boards — all of these things he talked about before election. Everything happening now with the dismantling of science programs and universities is exactly what Americans voted for.

mostlysimilar 1y ago
It's not even remotely helpful to keep parroting "this is what Americans wanted." Not only do Trump voters not represent a majority of Americans, the media landscape is so fractured that many people did not know what they were voting for and just wanted cheaper groceries. Is that stupid and naive? Yes. But it's also stupid and naive to generalize and say "Americans want this."
- Eisenstein 1y ago
  I think what they are saying is 'actions have consequences'.
  - punpunia 1y ago
    Okay great, that is utterly vacuous. Now what?
    - Braxton1980 1y ago
      [flagged]
- bruce511 1y ago
  I respect your opinion, but I disagree with it. Yes, just under half the voters will say they didn't vote for him. But more people did, and that's how democracy works. After the vote it's easy for people to blame the media, or to claim that he's doing things they didn't vote for. It's easy to just say "I'm not responsible for this". But democracy means the people vote. The winner is the ones with the most votes. If you voted wrong, that's on you, and you need to understand that, and acknowledge it. Only by taking responsibility can you understand the power you wield, and maybe wield it more carefully in the future. And no, none of the things he's found are a surprise. His character is no secret. His approach to politics is no secret. His policies are no secret. His willingness to grift is no secret. A plurality of those who voted chose him. Those that didn't vote decided he deserved half their vote. In truth I don't think it's stupid to say "Americans want this". Moderate Republicans are scared of being primaried. They know what their constituents want. I don't think all Americans want this. But I think a lot of them do. No one is predicting a Blue senate in 2 years. Those red seats are safe. Because deep down a big chunk of America is happy with this. This is the very essence of democracy. A govt of the people, voted by the people. Look at the govt. It's a mirror of the people who got them there, and keep them there. I get this is frustrating if you are a minority voter. Minorities get stomped on by majorities- that's the very core of democracy. So forgive me, but at least for 2 years we need to keep saying it - you voted for this. Because until lots of voters figure out just how responsible they are, they're not going to change. If you voted for this, take some responsibility. Edit: I see you're getting down voted. I disagree either that too. Your point is coherent and a common part of this conversation. Voting here is about conversation, not agreement.
- Braxton1980 1y ago
  > just wanted cheaper groceries. 1. And why would voting for Trump get that? 2. It didn't happen either way 3. Stupidity is not an acceptable excuse 4. You vote for a person not a specific policy
  - monetus 1y ago
    > You vote for a person not a specific policy You're not wrong as general rule of thumb imo, or in a straight sense of reality, but tell that to the evangelicals who spend their time slandering abortion.
    - Braxton1980 1y ago
      [flagged]
      - deleted 1y ago
        [deleted]
Whoppertime 1y ago
It's hard to hear people complain about looting and authoritarianism after watching these same people calling BLM mostly peaceful protest, and had no problem with the authoritarian policies passed during the COVID lockdowns https://fee.org/articles/george-floyd-riots-caused-record-setting-2-billion-in-damage-new-report-says-here-s-why-the-true-cost-is-even-higher/ https://fee.org/articles/george-floyd-riots-caused-record-se...
- gamma42 1y ago
  Remind us what both protests are for.
- bruce511 1y ago
  It's easy to play the hypocrisy card, theres plenty to go around. However in this case you're presenting a false equivalency. Yes, there were issues with BLM. the people got out of control. But that's not authoritarianism- if anything it was a lack of authority with caused dome of those problems. What you see with protests now is those with authority over-using that authority and wielding it as a weapon against the public. And I'm not sure COVID lock downs are a useful measure of anything. It was a unprecedented event and countries all over the world had all manner of restrictions, lock downs, and so on. Millions of people died, over a million Americans. It's always going to be easy in hindsight to blame those in authority for doing too much, or too little, too fast or too slow. Unlike most places, the US politicized the response, and even within the US the death rates varied from one state to the next. Anthropologists will be disecting covid data for generations to try and determine which approach was best.
  - Whoppertime 1y ago
    That's the thing. COVID was a crisis an emergency, and that justified emergency powers. Donald Trump is declaring the current situation an emergency and is making use of emergency powers. You cannot assume "your side" is going to maintain political power forever, and build institutions with that in mind. Build a political system then hand it to your political opponents to run for 4 years. I think people who cheered on the use of emergency powers over the last 4 years are going to have it boomerang back on them, as I predict the next Democratic president will use the precedent set by Trump in a way that will boomerang back on Trump supporters who were cheering him on
umbra07 1y ago
> Americans want looting and authoritarianism, so that's what they're getting. There's no excuses here after a majority of people voted for Trump's ret with his repeated promises that he wou be held back this time around. Why do you think it's appropriate to say "Americans want..." and "We got exactly what we voted for..." when only 32% of Americans voted for Trump?
- 0xffff2 1y ago
  After everything that happened up to the 2024 election, I think it's entirely reasonable to lump anyone who didn't vote at all in with those that explicitly voted for Trump.
  - johannes1234321 1y ago
    I would qualify it a bit: Those who were able to vote. There is a set of people too I'll to vote and there is a group of people who were hindered from voting. But yes, a big part of not voting people decided to not vote. If one decides to not vote one accepts the outcome and it it was know that the outcome would be Trump, and that Trump (or the people around him) would be more prepared and more unhinged than in the first term.
- Braxton1980 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - baggy_trough 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - labster 1y ago
      We live in an absurd reality. Or do you want to explain to me why Elon can threaten to disassemble the Crew Dragon just to get back at Donald, while somehow we consider women to be too irrational to lead? Also: all it takes for evil men to triumph is for good men to do nothing.
scoofy 1y ago
We are living through the baby boomer going-out-of-business fire sale right now, and it's just so deeply depressing. I have an entire theory of the ideological reasons why the parties are in a political realignment, but none of it really matters much, because the older folks with the least incentive to have long term strategies are staying in office forever.
- ModernMech 1y ago
  https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2020/04/28/millennials-overtake-baby-boomers-as-americas-largest-generation/ft_20-04-27_generationsize_1-png/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2020/04/28/millennia... Take the derivative of this chart, you see the boomer decline is accelerating to a crescendo. They're about to experience a lot of loss in their lives. They already are. I think their impending doom has a lot to do with what's going on now, given their generation is and has been in charge for the past many decades. If you know you're not going to live to see the next decade, and you're in charge of the whole world, what would you do? What wouldn't you do? The future is going to be interesting. We have a whole generation of millennials and genx who have had to live in the shadow of boomers for decades, and now that it's fading we're not ready for the spotlight. The boomer generation has been in charge since 1993. And yeah, I had to look it up but Obama is a boomer as well, albeit on the younger side. But we're expect to take over this whole ship pretty quickly, within the next decade or so. Personally I don't feel ready at 40 years old.
thrance 1y ago
Kinda. More precisely: Americans are getting what they were groomed into thinking they want. Hundreds of billions flowed into conservative media, from Fox News hosts to Rogan's, all manufacturing consent for the destruction of the American Republic in service of the very few.

mostlysimilar 1y ago

It's not even remotely helpful to keep parroting "this is what Americans wanted." Not only do Trump voters not represent a majority of Americans, the media landscape is so fractured that many people did not know what they were voting for and just wanted cheaper groceries. Is that stupid and naive? Yes. But it's also stupid and naive to generalize and say "Americans want this."

Eisenstein 1y ago
I think what they are saying is 'actions have consequences'.
- punpunia 1y ago
  Okay great, that is utterly vacuous. Now what?
  - Braxton1980 1y ago
    [flagged]
bruce511 1y ago
I respect your opinion, but I disagree with it. Yes, just under half the voters will say they didn't vote for him. But more people did, and that's how democracy works. After the vote it's easy for people to blame the media, or to claim that he's doing things they didn't vote for. It's easy to just say "I'm not responsible for this". But democracy means the people vote. The winner is the ones with the most votes. If you voted wrong, that's on you, and you need to understand that, and acknowledge it. Only by taking responsibility can you understand the power you wield, and maybe wield it more carefully in the future. And no, none of the things he's found are a surprise. His character is no secret. His approach to politics is no secret. His policies are no secret. His willingness to grift is no secret. A plurality of those who voted chose him. Those that didn't vote decided he deserved half their vote. In truth I don't think it's stupid to say "Americans want this". Moderate Republicans are scared of being primaried. They know what their constituents want. I don't think all Americans want this. But I think a lot of them do. No one is predicting a Blue senate in 2 years. Those red seats are safe. Because deep down a big chunk of America is happy with this. This is the very essence of democracy. A govt of the people, voted by the people. Look at the govt. It's a mirror of the people who got them there, and keep them there. I get this is frustrating if you are a minority voter. Minorities get stomped on by majorities- that's the very core of democracy. So forgive me, but at least for 2 years we need to keep saying it - you voted for this. Because until lots of voters figure out just how responsible they are, they're not going to change. If you voted for this, take some responsibility. Edit: I see you're getting down voted. I disagree either that too. Your point is coherent and a common part of this conversation. Voting here is about conversation, not agreement.
Braxton1980 1y ago
> just wanted cheaper groceries. 1. And why would voting for Trump get that? 2. It didn't happen either way 3. Stupidity is not an acceptable excuse 4. You vote for a person not a specific policy
- monetus 1y ago
  > You vote for a person not a specific policy You're not wrong as general rule of thumb imo, or in a straight sense of reality, but tell that to the evangelicals who spend their time slandering abortion.
  - Braxton1980 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]

Whoppertime 1y ago

It's hard to hear people complain about looting and authoritarianism after watching these same people calling BLM mostly peaceful protest, and had no problem with the authoritarian policies passed during the COVID lockdowns https://fee.org/articles/george-floyd-riots-caused-record-setting-2-billion-in-damage-new-report-says-here-s-why-the-true-cost-is-even-higher/ https://fee.org/articles/george-floyd-riots-caused-record-se...

gamma42 1y ago
Remind us what both protests are for.
bruce511 1y ago
It's easy to play the hypocrisy card, theres plenty to go around. However in this case you're presenting a false equivalency. Yes, there were issues with BLM. the people got out of control. But that's not authoritarianism- if anything it was a lack of authority with caused dome of those problems. What you see with protests now is those with authority over-using that authority and wielding it as a weapon against the public. And I'm not sure COVID lock downs are a useful measure of anything. It was a unprecedented event and countries all over the world had all manner of restrictions, lock downs, and so on. Millions of people died, over a million Americans. It's always going to be easy in hindsight to blame those in authority for doing too much, or too little, too fast or too slow. Unlike most places, the US politicized the response, and even within the US the death rates varied from one state to the next. Anthropologists will be disecting covid data for generations to try and determine which approach was best.
- Whoppertime 1y ago
  That's the thing. COVID was a crisis an emergency, and that justified emergency powers. Donald Trump is declaring the current situation an emergency and is making use of emergency powers. You cannot assume "your side" is going to maintain political power forever, and build institutions with that in mind. Build a political system then hand it to your political opponents to run for 4 years. I think people who cheered on the use of emergency powers over the last 4 years are going to have it boomerang back on them, as I predict the next Democratic president will use the precedent set by Trump in a way that will boomerang back on Trump supporters who were cheering him on

umbra07 1y ago

> Americans want looting and authoritarianism, so that's what they're getting. There's no excuses here after a majority of people voted for Trump's ret with his repeated promises that he wou be held back this time around. Why do you think it's appropriate to say "Americans want..." and "We got exactly what we voted for..." when only 32% of Americans voted for Trump?

0xffff2 1y ago
After everything that happened up to the 2024 election, I think it's entirely reasonable to lump anyone who didn't vote at all in with those that explicitly voted for Trump.
- johannes1234321 1y ago
  I would qualify it a bit: Those who were able to vote. There is a set of people too I'll to vote and there is a group of people who were hindered from voting. But yes, a big part of not voting people decided to not vote. If one decides to not vote one accepts the outcome and it it was know that the outcome would be Trump, and that Trump (or the people around him) would be more prepared and more unhinged than in the first term.
Braxton1980 1y ago
[flagged]
- baggy_trough 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - labster 1y ago
    We live in an absurd reality. Or do you want to explain to me why Elon can threaten to disassemble the Crew Dragon just to get back at Donald, while somehow we consider women to be too irrational to lead? Also: all it takes for evil men to triumph is for good men to do nothing.

scoofy 1y ago

We are living through the baby boomer going-out-of-business fire sale right now, and it's just so deeply depressing. I have an entire theory of the ideological reasons why the parties are in a political realignment, but none of it really matters much, because the older folks with the least incentive to have long term strategies are staying in office forever.

ModernMech 1y ago
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2020/04/28/millennials-overtake-baby-boomers-as-americas-largest-generation/ft_20-04-27_generationsize_1-png/ https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2020/04/28/millennia... Take the derivative of this chart, you see the boomer decline is accelerating to a crescendo. They're about to experience a lot of loss in their lives. They already are. I think their impending doom has a lot to do with what's going on now, given their generation is and has been in charge for the past many decades. If you know you're not going to live to see the next decade, and you're in charge of the whole world, what would you do? What wouldn't you do? The future is going to be interesting. We have a whole generation of millennials and genx who have had to live in the shadow of boomers for decades, and now that it's fading we're not ready for the spotlight. The boomer generation has been in charge since 1993. And yeah, I had to look it up but Obama is a boomer as well, albeit on the younger side. But we're expect to take over this whole ship pretty quickly, within the next decade or so. Personally I don't feel ready at 40 years old.

thrance 1y ago

Kinda. More precisely: Americans are getting what they were groomed into thinking they want. Hundreds of billions flowed into conservative media, from Fox News hosts to Rogan's, all manufacturing consent for the destruction of the American Republic in service of the very few.