3 ms·
>ASML, being Dutch, and crucial to essentially all cutting semiconductor production, gives Europe leverage It doesn't. Firstly, ASML's core EUV light source t
by FirmwareBurner 1y ago
>ASML, being Dutch, and crucial to essentially all cutting semiconductor production, gives Europe leverage
It doesn't.
Firstly, ASML's core EUV light source tech is licensed from the US who threatened to pull the plug if ASML sold EUV steppers to China. That's what actual leverage looks like.
Secondly, you also need cutting edge semi fabs, which EU lacks. If it were that easy ASML would open some fabs in its own back yard with its cutting edge machines and keep the highest profits for themselves instead of letting TSMC, Samsung and Intel have them, but it's not easy. EU semi fabs are behind Taiwan, the US, China and Japan in node sizes despite having ASML domestically which is a huge blow for domestic industry and leverage. That's like making the best hammers but having no idea how to use them effectively.
Thirdly, once you have the lithography machines and the fabs, you also need top IP to make cutting edge high margin chips with them, which the EU lacks. The highest grossing chips are all US IP: Nvidia, Apple, Qualcomm, AMD, Intel, Amazon, Ampere, while European chip companies are way down below the pecking order in profitability: Infineon, NXP, ST, making low margin chips the likes of Nvidia and AMD can't be bothered.
Fourthly(is that correct in English?), once you have your litho, fabs and high end chips, you can now put all those powerful chips into datacenters to create powerful cloud hyperscalers, which the EU lacks. EU has nothing close to AWS, GPC, Azure, Tencent, Alibaba.
This is what tech dominance looks like. And EU is third place behind the US and China.
- saubeidl 1y ago> Firstly, ASML's core EUV light source tech is licensed from the US who threatened to pull the plug if ASML sold EUV steppers to China. That's what actual leverage looks like. That's not any leverage at all. The EU would instantly write a law invalidating those licenses on their territory. Paperwork like that is meaningless in geopolitical conflicts.
- FirmwareBurner 1y agoThe asml EUV light source are made in California not Europe. Europe's laws and leverage would be useless in this case. They don't even have to burry ASML, they can sanction it, or better, just convince ASML to move all cutting edge operations on US soil like the US is doing with TSMC.
- saubeidl 1y agoI thought that was more of a measure of good will. I'm assuming the tech has been transferred and production could be spun up locally?
- FirmwareBurner 1y ago[flagged]
- saubeidl 1y agoWhy the hostile tone? You've also not given any evidence to support your claims.
- FirmwareBurner 1y agoDeflecting the conversation from me pointing out your misinformation based on assumptions, to my tone, is exactly what I expected from someone unwilling to admit he is wrong. It's not polite to abuse some's time and labor and have them google things for you, you can do that yourself if you want to check if what they said is correct before attacking them. The least you can do is abstain from making confidently incorrect assumptions and admit when you're wrong.
- saubeidl 1y agoYou still haven't backed up your claim that production couldn't be spun up in Europe. Instead, you deflect, ironically, by accusing me of deflection.
- FirmwareBurner 1y agoIf you can't google/ask a LLM about ASML and EUV why should I do it for you? Why waste time to convince a troll on the internet operating on thoughts and assumptions? I'm NOT asking you to believe what I said. If you don't believe me that's fine with me, just have the decency to google information yourself and provide your own counter arguments if you want to argue further, but don't be rude and expect others to provide information on a silver platter just for your lazy convenience. This is my last post here on the matter with you to save my sanity.