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Pair programming is also not suitable for all cases Maybe not for many cases I mentioned this elsewhere but I find it absolutely impossible to get into a good
by bluefirebrand 1y ago
Pair programming is also not suitable for all cases
Maybe not for many cases
I mentioned this elsewhere but I find it absolutely impossible to get into a good programming flow anymore while the LLM constantly interrupts me with suggested autocompletes that I have to stop, read, review, and accept/reject
It's been miserable trying to incorporate this into my workflow
- amazingamazing 1y agoCode regularly, and use ai to get unblocked if you do so or review code for mistakes. Or have the ai write the entire first draft for some piece and then you give it a once over, correcting it either manually or with prompts.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- bluefirebrand 1y agoThis is just the same workflow that I've already had with Documentation, Google, and Stack Overflow for years The AI doesn't seem to be adding any extra value? It's not like it is more accurate that SO, or that it produces answers any faster, honestly It just is much less trustworthy imo
- BowBun 1y agoSecond this. My solution is to have a 'non-AI' IDE and then a Cursor/VS Code to switch between. Deep work cannot be achieved by chatting with the coding bots, sorry.
- morkalork 1y agoThirded. It was just completely distracting and I had to turn it off. I use AI but not after every keystroke, jeez.
- latentsea 1y agoBut but but... "we are an AI-first company". Yeah, nah. Fourthed!
- mdp2021 1y ago> AI-first company Does anybody introduce itself like that? It's like when your date sends subtle signals, like kicking sleeping tramps in the street and snorting the flour over bread at the restaurant. (The shocking thing is that the expression would even make sense when taken properly - "we have organized our workflows through AI-intelligent systems" -, while at this time it easily means the opposite.)
- neilv 1y ago> > AI-first company > Does anybody introduce itself like that? Yes, I've started getting job posts sent to me that say that. Declaring one's company "AI-first" right now is a great time-saver: I know instantly that I can disregard that company.
- gen220 1y agoYou should try aider! This is my workflow, essentially
- soulofmischief 1y ago> Deep work cannot be achieved by chatting with the coding bots, sorry. ...by you. Meanwhile, plenty of us have found a way to enhance our productivity during deep work. No need for the patronization.
- bluefirebrand 1y agoI don't believe you experience deep work the same way I do then In my mind you cannot do deep work while being interrupted constantly, and LLM agents are constant interruptions
- soulofmischief 1y agoYou can do better than a No true Scotsman fallacy. The fact is that not everyone works the same way you do, or interacts the same way with agents. They are not constant interruptions if you use them correctly. Essentially, this is a skill issue and you're at the first peak of the Dunning–Kruger curve, sooner ready to dismiss those with more experience in this area as being less experienced, instead of keeping an open mind and attempting to learn from those who contradict your beliefs. You could have asked for tips since I said I've found a way to work deeply with them, but instead chose to assume that you knew better. This kind of attitude will stunt your ability to adopt these programs in the same way that many people were dismissive about personal computers or the internet and got left behind.
- girvo 1y agoIt’s quite amusing to see you complain about patronisation, and then see you turn about and do it yourself one comment later.
- soulofmischief 1y agoI'm open to hearing how being honest with them about their negative approach is patronizing them.
- NicoSchwandner 1y agoI do this as well and it works quite well for me like that! Additionally, when working on microservices and on issues that don’t seem too straightforward, I use o3 and copy the whole code of the repo into the prompt and refine a plan there and then paste it as a prompt into cursor. Handy if you don’t have MAX mode, but a company-sponsored ChatGPT.
- vasusen 1y agoI do this too by pasting only the relevant context files into O3 or Claude 4. We have an internal tool that just lets us select folders/files and spit out one giant markdown.
- thunspa 1y agoI just cmd + shift + p -> disable Cursor tab -> enter Sure, you could just add a shortcut too. After a while, it turns into a habit.
- BowBun 1y agoHonestly this might do the trick...
- SV_BubbleTime 1y agoThis is kind of intentionally the flow with Claude code as I’ve experienced it. I’m in VSCode doing my thing, and it’s in a terminal window that occasionally needs or wants my attention. I can go off and be AI-Free for as long as I like.
- flessner 1y agoI recently got a new laptop and had to setup my IDE again. After a couple hours of coding something felt "weird" - turns out I forgot to login to GitHub Copilot and I was working without it the entire time. I felt a lot more proactive and confident as I wasn't waiting on the autocomplete. Also, Cursor was exceptional at interrupting any kind of "flow" - who even wants their next cursor position predicted? I'll probably keep Copilot disabled for now and stick to the agent-style tools like aider for boilerplate or redundant tasks.
- johnfn 1y ago> who even wants their next cursor position predicted I'm fascinated by how different workflows are. This single feature has saved me a staggering amount of time.
- ipaddr 1y agoIt's strange the pure llm workflow and boring. I still write most of my own code and will llms when I'm too lazy to write the next piece. If I give it to an llm most of my time is spent debugging and reprompting. I hate fixing someone elses bug. Plus I like the feeling of the coding flow..wind at my back. Each keystroke putting us one step closer. The apps I made with llms I never want to go back to but the apps I made by hand piece by piece getting a chemical reaction when problems were solved are the ones I think positively about and want to go back to. I always did math on paper or my head and never used a calculator. Its a skill I never have forgotten and I worry how many programmers won't be able to code without llms in the future.
- baq 1y ago> Also, Cursor was exceptional at interrupting any kind of "flow" - who even wants their next cursor position predicted? Me, I use this all the time. It’s actually predictable and saves lots of time when doing similar edits in a large file. It’s about as powerful as multi-line regex search and replace, except you don’t have to write the regex.
- barrenko 1y agoSame, I like agents or nothing in between.
- jumploops 1y agoI’m a Vim user and couldn’t agree more. Didn’t like any of the AI-IDEs, but loved using LLMs for spinning up one off solutions (copy/paste). Not to be a fan boy, but Claude Code is my new LLM workflow. It’s tough trying to get it to do everything, but works really well with a targeted task on an existing code base. Perfect harmony of a traditional code editor (Vim) with an LLM-enhanced workflow in my experience.
- brianpan 1y agoAI "auto-complete" or "code suggestions" is the worst, especially if you are in a strongly-type language because it's 80% correct and competing with an IDE that can be 100% correct. AI agents are much better for me because 1) they don't constantly interrupt your train of thought and 2) they can run compile, run tests, etc. to discover they are incorrect and fix it before handing the code back to you.
- dinosaurdynasty 1y agoI love the autocomplete, honestly use it more than any other AI feature. But I'm forced to write in Go which has a lot of boilerplate (and no, some kind of code library or whatever would not help... it's just easier to type at that point). It's great because it helps with stuff that's too much of a hassle to talk to the AI for (just quicker to type). I also read very fast so one line suggestions are just instant anyway (like non AI autocomplete), and longer ones I can see if it's close enough to what I was going to type anyway. And eventually it gets to the point where you just kinda know what it's going to do. Not an amazing boost, but it does let me be lazy writing log messages and for loops and such. I think you do need to read it much faster than you can write it to be helpful though.
- CraigJPerry 1y agoZed has a "subtle" mode, hopefully that feature can become table stakes in all AI editor integrations
- rsynnott 1y agoI’ve always seen it as primarily an _education_ tool; the purpose of pair programming isn’t that two people pair programming are more productive than two people working individually, they’re generally not. So pair programming with a magic robot seems rather futile; it’s not going to learn anything.
- searls 1y agoLLMs in their current incarnation will not, but there's nothing inherently preventing them from learning. Contexts are getting large enough that having a sidecar database living with each project or individual as a sort of corpus of "shit I learned pairing with Justin" is already completely achievable, if only a product company wanted to do that.
- GrantMoyer 1y agoClaude Plays Pokemon is kind of an interesting case study for this. This sort of knowledgebase is implemented, but even state of the art models struggle to use it effectively. They seem to fixate on small snippets from the knowledge base without any ability to consider greater context.
- hk1337 1y ago> Pair programming is also not suitable for all cases I think this is true but pair programming can work for most circumstances. The times where it doesn't work is usually because one or both parties are not all-in with the process. Either someone is skeptical about pair programming and thinks it never works or they're trying to enforce a strict interpretation of pair programming.
- bluefirebrand 1y agoIt doesn't work when someone already has a solution in mind and all they need to do is type it into the editor I've been doing this a while. This is most of my work