3 ms·

It's called immigration, and it's how US was created. You have more than enough free space in the US for several times the current population.

by megous 1y ago

dazilcher 1y ago
You conveniently ignored the illegal part.
- drekk 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - unstablediffusi 1y ago
    then perhaps it would be wise to learn from the fate that befell the native population? ;)
- legitster 1y ago
  Most illegal immigrants entered the country legally and are overstaying on expired visas. Given the federal government is actively revoking and eliminating massive amounts of visas, they are essentially creating "illegal" immigrants with the stroke of a pen. If people actually cared about stopping people entering the country illegally, it would be as easy as extending all resident visas and these communities would be happy to turn on the bad actors they moved here to run from.
  - crises-luff-6b 1y ago
    > Most illegal immigrants entered the country legally and are overstaying on expired visas. Overstaying an expired visa is illegal bro. What world are we living in? https://www.uscis.gov/laws-and-policy/other-resources/unlawful-presence-and-inadmissibility https://www.uscis.gov/laws-and-policy/other-resources/unlawf...
    - legitster 1y ago
      No one is arguing that it's legal. But it's unfair and misleading to characterize all illegals as willful lawbreakers when what actually happens is usually just a legal rug pull. The government can change the terms of the visas on a whim. If you've lived in the US with your family for decades and they decide to deny a renewal with no recourse, what realistically are you going to do? The reality is that most people are illegal simply because both politicians benefited from slapping the label on people for so long. You get the benefit of immigration, but you can pretend to be tough on it, and also deprive large swaths of your working class from expensive benefits and rights. The existing laws are unfair, unjust, and immoral. Lumping in a huge portion of the working class together with actual drug runners and criminals is an intentional and preventable error.
    - digitaltrees 1y ago
      So you'd send Elon back I assume?
- megous 1y ago
  Because I care very little about "legality" of what people do to a virtual entity that we all call "the united states", with all its made up rules. I learned it from the US itself, and how it treats the rest of the world. Legality is optional and subject to political considerations, and desire for money and power.
like_any_other 1y ago
> It's called immigration You mean to say you want to call it that. But that immigration was non-consensual, and as we see now, mostly peaceful only because it was not resisted. > it's how US was created And how did that work out for the previous inhabitants?
- drekk 1y ago
  It's mostly citizens and residents protesting in solidarity. People who came here the "right" way. Undocumented folks try to minimize interactions with law enforcement. That immigration is desired by all these red state agribusiness entities that receive no punishment. Curious that we're deploying thousands of soldiers to a blue state to deport... 100 people so far? When they could much more easily go after the people paying these migrants under the table. They wouldn't come here if they couldn't make money doing so. Trump is clearly a television personality and lives for the drama. Makes sense why Obama and Biden managed to deport more people during their terms.
  - like_any_other 1y ago
    They deported many, and incentivized even more to come, by actions like deportation protection for 5 million [1], or special programs to allow 500k more to come [2]. And while the federal government cut funds to states that set their own drinking age [3], it did nothing when those same states flaunted immigration laws (so-called "sanctuary" states & cities). So long as they permit more immigrants to come. If they tried to enforce immigration laws, i.e. the border, their efforts were swiftly crushed [4]. I don't know how effective Trump is at border control, but to imply previous administrations (Republicans included) were hostile to immigration, legal or illegal, is laughable. [1] https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2014/11/20/365519963/obama-will-announce-relief-for-up-to-5-million-immigrants https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2014/11/20/365519963... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parole_for_Cubans%2C_Haitians%2C_Nicaraguans%2C_and_Venezuelans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parole_for_Cubans%2C_Haitians%... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_alcohol_laws_of_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_alcohol_laws_of_the_Un... [4] https://www.reuters.com/legal/texas-seeks-court-block-biden-administrations-destruction-border-fencing-2024-06-06/ https://www.reuters.com/legal/texas-seeks-court-block-biden-...

It's called immigration, and it's how US was created. You have more than enough free space in the US for several times the current population.

by megous 1y ago

It's called immigration, and it's how US was created. You have more than enough free space in the US for several times the current population.

dazilcher 1y ago

You conveniently ignored the illegal part.

drekk 1y ago
[flagged]
- unstablediffusi 1y ago
  then perhaps it would be wise to learn from the fate that befell the native population? ;)
legitster 1y ago
Most illegal immigrants entered the country legally and are overstaying on expired visas. Given the federal government is actively revoking and eliminating massive amounts of visas, they are essentially creating "illegal" immigrants with the stroke of a pen. If people actually cared about stopping people entering the country illegally, it would be as easy as extending all resident visas and these communities would be happy to turn on the bad actors they moved here to run from.
- crises-luff-6b 1y ago
  > Most illegal immigrants entered the country legally and are overstaying on expired visas. Overstaying an expired visa is illegal bro. What world are we living in? https://www.uscis.gov/laws-and-policy/other-resources/unlawful-presence-and-inadmissibility https://www.uscis.gov/laws-and-policy/other-resources/unlawf...
  - legitster 1y ago
    No one is arguing that it's legal. But it's unfair and misleading to characterize all illegals as willful lawbreakers when what actually happens is usually just a legal rug pull. The government can change the terms of the visas on a whim. If you've lived in the US with your family for decades and they decide to deny a renewal with no recourse, what realistically are you going to do? The reality is that most people are illegal simply because both politicians benefited from slapping the label on people for so long. You get the benefit of immigration, but you can pretend to be tough on it, and also deprive large swaths of your working class from expensive benefits and rights. The existing laws are unfair, unjust, and immoral. Lumping in a huge portion of the working class together with actual drug runners and criminals is an intentional and preventable error.
  - digitaltrees 1y ago
    So you'd send Elon back I assume?
megous 1y ago
Because I care very little about "legality" of what people do to a virtual entity that we all call "the united states", with all its made up rules. I learned it from the US itself, and how it treats the rest of the world. Legality is optional and subject to political considerations, and desire for money and power.

like_any_other 1y ago

> It's called immigration You mean to say you want to call it that. But that immigration was non-consensual, and as we see now, mostly peaceful only because it was not resisted. > it's how US was created And how did that work out for the previous inhabitants?

drekk 1y ago
It's mostly citizens and residents protesting in solidarity. People who came here the "right" way. Undocumented folks try to minimize interactions with law enforcement. That immigration is desired by all these red state agribusiness entities that receive no punishment. Curious that we're deploying thousands of soldiers to a blue state to deport... 100 people so far? When they could much more easily go after the people paying these migrants under the table. They wouldn't come here if they couldn't make money doing so. Trump is clearly a television personality and lives for the drama. Makes sense why Obama and Biden managed to deport more people during their terms.
- like_any_other 1y ago
  They deported many, and incentivized even more to come, by actions like deportation protection for 5 million [1], or special programs to allow 500k more to come [2]. And while the federal government cut funds to states that set their own drinking age [3], it did nothing when those same states flaunted immigration laws (so-called "sanctuary" states & cities). So long as they permit more immigrants to come. If they tried to enforce immigration laws, i.e. the border, their efforts were swiftly crushed [4]. I don't know how effective Trump is at border control, but to imply previous administrations (Republicans included) were hostile to immigration, legal or illegal, is laughable. [1] https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2014/11/20/365519963/obama-will-announce-relief-for-up-to-5-million-immigrants https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2014/11/20/365519963... [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parole_for_Cubans%2C_Haitians%2C_Nicaraguans%2C_and_Venezuelans https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parole_for_Cubans%2C_Haitians%... [3] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_alcohol_laws_of_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_alcohol_laws_of_the_Un... [4] https://www.reuters.com/legal/texas-seeks-court-block-biden-administrations-destruction-border-fencing-2024-06-06/ https://www.reuters.com/legal/texas-seeks-court-block-biden-...