3 ms·

ok, why? any grand plan? what's the background and why would anyone bet on X.org when wayland has been ok for a decade now?

DaSHacka 1y ago
> when wayland has been ok for a decade now? Looks like developers from Valve that were tasked on working on Wayland don't agree[0]. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41640420 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41640420
- LexiMax 1y ago
  Am I missing something? I don't see where it's mentioned that Valve is exhuming the corpse of X.Org.
  - DaSHacka 1y ago
    The quoted text, and what I was responding to, was: "when wayland has been okay for a decade now"
    - LexiMax 1y ago
      I am aware. The complete rhetorical question was: > "why would anyone bet on X.org when wayland has been ok for a decade now?" Valve saw problems with the Wayland protocol evolution process. Their solution was to build on top of Wayland, not exhume the corpse of X.org.
creatonez 1y ago
There is no grand plan. It's just more garbage piled on top of garbage.
- DaSHacka 1y ago
  But enough about Wayland
  - creatonez 1y ago
    It's also garbage piled on top of garbage, but slightly less garbage and hasn't yet been stopped dead in its tracks by horrific architecture.
    - uecker 1y ago
      I have to say I find the architecture of X much better than Wayland's. It is mostly the same, except X is more modular which I think it is a problem that Wayland is not.
airhangerf15 1y ago
Wayland is still pretty garbage. Hyprland is the most viable window manager replacement. The community is amazing too, way better than the Sway people. Lots of help from their forums and chatroom. Still, I had trouble with some basic stuff not working. So much tool replacement! So much work, for so little reward. With i3/X11, I can run xrandr and see all my disconnected displays. As far as I can tell, there is absolutely no way to see disconnected display outputs in any wlroots or other Wayland composer. None. There's no standard way to do screenshots or video recording. It requires some custom portal for every single composer. I've never gotten Flameshot working in Sway or Hyprland and the suggested replacements are clobbered together garbage. I do use network transparency (ssh -Y) quite often and it's not there in Wayland. i3/X11 is just so much better and smother and I don't see the gain of Wayland. It's 100x more difficult to write programs that need to work in different composers. I hope this project succeeded and we really do see an X11R8 out of it. I'm old enough to remember the switch from XFree86 -> xorg. I hope we see that again and we have real competition so the Wayland devs can finally get around to fixing their broken garbage of a display regression.
- Mordagh 1y ago
  > I do use network transparency (ssh -Y) quite often and it's not there in Wayland. There's waypipe (https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mstoeckl/waypipe https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mstoeckl/waypipe), which works well in my experience. Although I must say I don't use network transparency (be it X or Wayland) much these days.

DaSHacka 1y ago

> when wayland has been ok for a decade now? Looks like developers from Valve that were tasked on working on Wayland don't agree[0]. [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41640420 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41640420

LexiMax 1y ago
Am I missing something? I don't see where it's mentioned that Valve is exhuming the corpse of X.Org.
- DaSHacka 1y ago
  The quoted text, and what I was responding to, was: "when wayland has been okay for a decade now"
  - LexiMax 1y ago
    I am aware. The complete rhetorical question was: > "why would anyone bet on X.org when wayland has been ok for a decade now?" Valve saw problems with the Wayland protocol evolution process. Their solution was to build on top of Wayland, not exhume the corpse of X.org.

creatonez 1y ago

There is no grand plan. It's just more garbage piled on top of garbage.

DaSHacka 1y ago
But enough about Wayland
- creatonez 1y ago
  It's also garbage piled on top of garbage, but slightly less garbage and hasn't yet been stopped dead in its tracks by horrific architecture.
  - uecker 1y ago
    I have to say I find the architecture of X much better than Wayland's. It is mostly the same, except X is more modular which I think it is a problem that Wayland is not.

airhangerf15 1y ago

Wayland is still pretty garbage. Hyprland is the most viable window manager replacement. The community is amazing too, way better than the Sway people. Lots of help from their forums and chatroom. Still, I had trouble with some basic stuff not working. So much tool replacement! So much work, for so little reward. With i3/X11, I can run xrandr and see all my disconnected displays. As far as I can tell, there is absolutely no way to see disconnected display outputs in any wlroots or other Wayland composer. None. There's no standard way to do screenshots or video recording. It requires some custom portal for every single composer. I've never gotten Flameshot working in Sway or Hyprland and the suggested replacements are clobbered together garbage. I do use network transparency (ssh -Y) quite often and it's not there in Wayland. i3/X11 is just so much better and smother and I don't see the gain of Wayland. It's 100x more difficult to write programs that need to work in different composers. I hope this project succeeded and we really do see an X11R8 out of it. I'm old enough to remember the switch from XFree86 -> xorg. I hope we see that again and we have real competition so the Wayland devs can finally get around to fixing their broken garbage of a display regression.

Mordagh 1y ago
> I do use network transparency (ssh -Y) quite often and it's not there in Wayland. There's waypipe (https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mstoeckl/waypipe https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/mstoeckl/waypipe), which works well in my experience. Although I must say I don't use network transparency (be it X or Wayland) much these days.