4 ms·

It's still running fine for me with actual interesting content. I don't get this take, feels like only people who don't use it at all (anymore) say it's been a

It's still running fine for me with actual interesting content. I don't get this take, feels like only people who don't use it at all (anymore) say it's been a bad transition or "X sucks now" but they're not using it. It's still just Twitter, but you're not being banned anymore. So ACTUAL discussions can take place without having the thought police running around with a banhammer.

paulryanrogers 1y ago
"ACTUAL discussions" like what? Because it would seem hate speech has had quite a surge: https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0313293# https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal...
- righthand 1y ago
  That’s a pretty damning study, post-purchase hate speech is nearly half the Twitter content. Sounds like hate speech is the “actual discussions”.
  - jeffhuys 1y ago
    That seems like a weird take. If 80% of the internet is spam (which it very well could be), is spam the internet? I guess censorship is a popular thing now on HN. Never thought I would see all you people advocating FOR censorship. I’m happy Elon seems unmoving in his stance on this. We need to progress.
    - righthand 1y ago
      The internet isn’t Twitter, people aren’t advocating for censoring the internet, they’re advocating for censoring a person on a digital service platform. If you don’t think you’d see people advocating for censorship on HackerNews then you don’t understand what HN platform is, because bans, downvotes, flagging, etc are all types of censorship. If you don’t like the platform censoring you, go somewhere else or do what Elon did and buy the platform and change the rules for yourself.
    - singleshot_ 1y ago
      I believe it’s called a “coherent speech product,” not censorship. I loathe the poorly educated.
    - paulryanrogers 1y ago
      A lot of spam is censored by laws like CAN-SPAM act and fraud laws. Private mail services also censor spam with their own terms of service, with rules like DMARC.
- jeffhuys 1y ago
  Of course it surges when you re-instate complete free speech. But now you could interact with them, discuss with them, maybe sway them another way. Or you just ignore them and scroll away, or even block them, so the algorithm knows you don't want that content. They're already being pulled down by the alg. It's just allowed now, and why shouldn't it be? I think it's better for humanity overall if these people are not pushed into a small echo-chamber but instead can speak freely and openly. We should go back to sticks & stones. Let hate flow off you and instead look for love, which is also still there.
  - sumeno 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - jeffhuys 1y ago
      One word causing post visibility restriction is not enough for your post to make sense. Other slurs also cause this to happen, which you would probably agree with. The post is still available for reading, and will still appear under the post it's a reply to, just at the bottom behind a button.
      - sumeno 1y ago
        cisgender is not a slur
        jeffhuys 1y ago
        I think it depends on how it’s said, and opinion. It would be nice if both of you addressed the actual point I’m trying to make instead of trying to gotcha me.
      - i80and 1y ago
        > "other slurs" Yeah, "cisgender" is a normal descriptive word, not a slur, and it's really quite strange that anybody would think it is
nilamo 1y ago
I won't speak for others, but I refuse to use a service that doesnt work if I'm not signed in. But when it did work, there didn't appear to be overzealous banning, and all the banning conversation appeared to be coming from sources that deserved to be banned, imo. So when you say "it's still good" while also mentioning thought police, I take what you're saying with a huge grain of salt, as I never noticed thought police to begin with, so less of something unnoticable sounds very close to "complete anarchy, nazis, and that's how we like it". Like 4chan put on a business suit.
- jeffhuys 1y ago
  If you never noticed the thought police, you were of the kind of people that Twitter wanted there to exclusively be. That's okay, but not a realistic view of the world. However, people with differing ideologies were pushed away. Yes, that includes literal nazis. But that also includes people who don't agree with the status-quo and want to see something different. The old twitter gave the impression of a world where 99% of the people agree with the current state of things, which is just not reality. X is the only platform where you can see the real state of the world, raw, unedited. That's INCREDIBLY valuable and I'm absolutely baffled by how everyone here seems to celebrate censorship. We fought wars over this.
  - i80and 1y ago
    Yeah the censorship is overbearing now. I've since deleted my account of a decade but just using the word "cis" got a post of mine immediately auto-moderated. I think people talking about how new-Twitter is somehow a bastion of free speech or whatever are just telling on themselves about what they think speech is.
    - jeffhuys 1y ago
      Are you banned? Is your post deleted? No? Then it’s not censorship. Again, if you don’t match with the vision, don’t use the platform. But you have to accept that the platform exists, is very popular, and allows free speech, and you can’t change that.
happosai 1y ago
The Amazing actual discussions: https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1876168991330439314 https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1876168991330439314 Yeah I'm not going to return to a website that doesn't ban people unable to have a civilized conversation.
- jeffhuys 1y ago
  > I'm not going to return to a website that doesn't ban people unable to have a civilized conversation That's your choice! Perfectly fine. For me, I don't want to close my eyes for what the world is actually thinking, even when they're in rage-mode. I think that makes your own thinking very narrow. Also, it's a conscious choice they made - they're the only platform I know of that allows you saying anything with no penalty except for maybe a algorithmic one. That doesn't mean it sucks, or is a bad platform, or the transition failed.
  - hobs 1y ago
    Except for criticizing musk in the papers, as he's banned journalists, people "doxing" him by publishing his plane, etc There's a million things you cant say, its now you are happy that the right wing nutjobs get to have their peace in public - that's the only part of the conversation that's "now allowed"
    - jeffhuys 1y ago
      I’ve already addressed the first part of your comment in another comment. I don’t think there’s a million things you can’t say. I see tons of posts criticizing Elon. But I also see tons of people defending him in replies. This is what we should want. Discussion. Open talking. And that includes “right wing nutjobs”. If the vision you’re seemingly okay with censoring is so damaging that you can’t fight it with words, is the opposing vision strong enough?
  - happosai 1y ago
    Twitter won't open my eyes to the "world is actually thinking". It is a rather minor social media in the big picture: https://www.statista.com/statistics/272014/global-social-networks-ranked-by-number-of-users/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/272014/global-social-net... There are certainly much better ways to learn what the world is thinking than a website without effective moderation. The problem was never "censorship" or "people are not allowed to say everything". The problem is the quantity of garbage the information supersewer generates and finding what is true and relevant.
kemotep 1y ago
Well 2 years ago Elon completely broke twitter for me by requiring an account. 10 years of using twitter then poof no more twitter access. I don’t know why an account is necessary to read updates from government agencies and local organizations after 10 years of not needing to do that.

paulryanrogers 1y ago

"ACTUAL discussions" like what? Because it would seem hate speech has had quite a surge: https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0313293# https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal...

righthand 1y ago
That’s a pretty damning study, post-purchase hate speech is nearly half the Twitter content. Sounds like hate speech is the “actual discussions”.
- jeffhuys 1y ago
  That seems like a weird take. If 80% of the internet is spam (which it very well could be), is spam the internet? I guess censorship is a popular thing now on HN. Never thought I would see all you people advocating FOR censorship. I’m happy Elon seems unmoving in his stance on this. We need to progress.
  - righthand 1y ago
    The internet isn’t Twitter, people aren’t advocating for censoring the internet, they’re advocating for censoring a person on a digital service platform. If you don’t think you’d see people advocating for censorship on HackerNews then you don’t understand what HN platform is, because bans, downvotes, flagging, etc are all types of censorship. If you don’t like the platform censoring you, go somewhere else or do what Elon did and buy the platform and change the rules for yourself.
  - singleshot_ 1y ago
    I believe it’s called a “coherent speech product,” not censorship. I loathe the poorly educated.
  - paulryanrogers 1y ago
    A lot of spam is censored by laws like CAN-SPAM act and fraud laws. Private mail services also censor spam with their own terms of service, with rules like DMARC.
jeffhuys 1y ago
Of course it surges when you re-instate complete free speech. But now you could interact with them, discuss with them, maybe sway them another way. Or you just ignore them and scroll away, or even block them, so the algorithm knows you don't want that content. They're already being pulled down by the alg. It's just allowed now, and why shouldn't it be? I think it's better for humanity overall if these people are not pushed into a small echo-chamber but instead can speak freely and openly. We should go back to sticks & stones. Let hate flow off you and instead look for love, which is also still there.
- sumeno 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - jeffhuys 1y ago
    One word causing post visibility restriction is not enough for your post to make sense. Other slurs also cause this to happen, which you would probably agree with. The post is still available for reading, and will still appear under the post it's a reply to, just at the bottom behind a button.
    - sumeno 1y ago
      cisgender is not a slur
      - jeffhuys 1y ago
        I think it depends on how it’s said, and opinion. It would be nice if both of you addressed the actual point I’m trying to make instead of trying to gotcha me.
    - i80and 1y ago
      > "other slurs" Yeah, "cisgender" is a normal descriptive word, not a slur, and it's really quite strange that anybody would think it is

nilamo 1y ago

I won't speak for others, but I refuse to use a service that doesnt work if I'm not signed in. But when it did work, there didn't appear to be overzealous banning, and all the banning conversation appeared to be coming from sources that deserved to be banned, imo. So when you say "it's still good" while also mentioning thought police, I take what you're saying with a huge grain of salt, as I never noticed thought police to begin with, so less of something unnoticable sounds very close to "complete anarchy, nazis, and that's how we like it". Like 4chan put on a business suit.

jeffhuys 1y ago
If you never noticed the thought police, you were of the kind of people that Twitter wanted there to exclusively be. That's okay, but not a realistic view of the world. However, people with differing ideologies were pushed away. Yes, that includes literal nazis. But that also includes people who don't agree with the status-quo and want to see something different. The old twitter gave the impression of a world where 99% of the people agree with the current state of things, which is just not reality. X is the only platform where you can see the real state of the world, raw, unedited. That's INCREDIBLY valuable and I'm absolutely baffled by how everyone here seems to celebrate censorship. We fought wars over this.
- i80and 1y ago
  Yeah the censorship is overbearing now. I've since deleted my account of a decade but just using the word "cis" got a post of mine immediately auto-moderated. I think people talking about how new-Twitter is somehow a bastion of free speech or whatever are just telling on themselves about what they think speech is.
  - jeffhuys 1y ago
    Are you banned? Is your post deleted? No? Then it’s not censorship. Again, if you don’t match with the vision, don’t use the platform. But you have to accept that the platform exists, is very popular, and allows free speech, and you can’t change that.

happosai 1y ago

The Amazing actual discussions: https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1876168991330439314 https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1876168991330439314 Yeah I'm not going to return to a website that doesn't ban people unable to have a civilized conversation.

jeffhuys 1y ago
> I'm not going to return to a website that doesn't ban people unable to have a civilized conversation That's your choice! Perfectly fine. For me, I don't want to close my eyes for what the world is actually thinking, even when they're in rage-mode. I think that makes your own thinking very narrow. Also, it's a conscious choice they made - they're the only platform I know of that allows you saying anything with no penalty except for maybe a algorithmic one. That doesn't mean it sucks, or is a bad platform, or the transition failed.
- hobs 1y ago
  Except for criticizing musk in the papers, as he's banned journalists, people "doxing" him by publishing his plane, etc There's a million things you cant say, its now you are happy that the right wing nutjobs get to have their peace in public - that's the only part of the conversation that's "now allowed"
  - jeffhuys 1y ago
    I’ve already addressed the first part of your comment in another comment. I don’t think there’s a million things you can’t say. I see tons of posts criticizing Elon. But I also see tons of people defending him in replies. This is what we should want. Discussion. Open talking. And that includes “right wing nutjobs”. If the vision you’re seemingly okay with censoring is so damaging that you can’t fight it with words, is the opposing vision strong enough?
- happosai 1y ago
  Twitter won't open my eyes to the "world is actually thinking". It is a rather minor social media in the big picture: https://www.statista.com/statistics/272014/global-social-networks-ranked-by-number-of-users/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/272014/global-social-net... There are certainly much better ways to learn what the world is thinking than a website without effective moderation. The problem was never "censorship" or "people are not allowed to say everything". The problem is the quantity of garbage the information supersewer generates and finding what is true and relevant.

kemotep 1y ago

Well 2 years ago Elon completely broke twitter for me by requiring an account. 10 years of using twitter then poof no more twitter access. I don’t know why an account is necessary to read updates from government agencies and local organizations after 10 years of not needing to do that.