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Provided they release crash data for all manufacturers and don't single out just one manufacturer.

by e44858 1y ago

FireBeyond 1y ago
Uhh, WaPo was requesting crash data from NHTSA on driver assistance systems. Tesla is the only manufacturer trying to prevent that disclosure.
kjs3 1y ago
[flagged]
- deleted 1y ago
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- bdcravens 1y ago
  The "We'll wait" isn't really seen as effective discourse here like it on on Reddit/Twitter. Just state your argument and let it stand on its own without the perceived "mic drop".
duxup 1y ago
I agree, although that's more about the request(er) than anything else.
ra7 1y ago
Crash data for all other ADAS systems is already public [1]. The only manufacturer with heavily redacted information in that data to the point of being useless is Tesla. [1] https://www.nhtsa.gov/laws-regulations/standing-general-order-crash-reporting#data https://www.nhtsa.gov/laws-regulations/standing-general-orde...
- andsoitis 1y ago
  > The only manufacturer with heavily redacted information in that data to the point of being useless is Tesla. The nice thing is we can look for ourselves to what extent that is true by downloading the CSV: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/ffdd/sgo-2021-01/SGO-2021-01_Incident_Reports_ADAS.csv https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/ffdd/sgo-2021-01/SGO-2021-01_In... For example, in the case of BMW, in every single case the field for ADS/ADAS Version is either blank or redacted.
  - armsaw 1y ago
    When I look at this data, I see the type of self driving in use, as well as the written narrative of every crash, along with several other fields as REDACTED FOR BUSINESS REASONS, only for Tesla vehicles, where every other manufacturer seems to have these fields populated. To me, that information would be crucial to understanding what actually happened in each case, as opposed to only being able to understand some of the ambient conditions around each accident.
    - andsoitis 1y ago
      > REDACTED FOR BUSINESS REASONS, only for Tesla vehicles, where every other manufacturer seems to have these fields populated. Not true. There are many rows for other manufacturers where fields are redacted or blank. For example: - Row 7. BMW. ADAS/ADS Version: blank - Row 8. BMW. ADAS/ADS Version: redacted - Row 9. Subaru. ADAS/ADS Version: redacted etc.
      - armsaw 1y ago
        Granted there are some other rows with missing or incomplete information, but Tesla appears to be the only manufacturer for which this information is withheld in every single instance without exception.
        andsoitis 1y ago
        > Granted there are some other rows with missing or incomplete information, but Tesla appears to be the only manufacturer for which this information is withheld in every single instance without exception. Again, not true. I just filtered for BMW, and in every single instance, without fail, the ADS/ADAS Version cell is either redacted or blank. I didn't check other manufacturers.
        zimpenfish 1y ago
        Did a quick check and yeah, there's a lot of redaction/blanks in `ADAS/ADS System Version` Rpts RdBl Pcage Entity 48 12 25.00 Ford Motor Company 18 6 33.33 Rivian Automotive, LLC 10 4 40.00 Volkswagen Group of America, Inc. 29 12 41.38 Mercedes-Benz USA, LLC 38 18 47.37 Lucid USA, Inc. 27 15 55.56 Hyundai Motor America 37 22 59.46 Kia America, Inc. 6 4 66.67 APTIV 6 5 83.33 Porsche Cars North America, Inc. 12 10 83.33 Daimler Trucks North America, LLC 159 156 98.11 Honda (American Honda Motor Co.) 126 124 98.41 Subaru of America, Inc. 3003 3001 99.93 Tesla, Inc. 1 1 100.00 Nuro 2 2 100.00 Mazda North American Operations 6 6 100.00 Chrysler (FCA US, LLC) 71 71 100.00 BMW of North America, LLC
- bumby 1y ago
  Not “all” crash data, though. >and the crash involves a vulnerable road user being struck or results in a fatality, an air bag deployment, or any individual being transported to a hospital for medical treatment.
  - ra7 1y ago
    This was a recent change by the current administration to loosen previously stricter data reporting requirements: https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/us-agency-ease-self-driving-vehicle-deployment-hurdles-retain-reporting-rules-2025-04-24/ https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/us-age...
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]
deleted 1y ago
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Provided they release crash data for all manufacturers and don't single out just one manufacturer.

by e44858 1y ago

Provided they release crash data for all manufacturers and don't single out just one manufacturer.

Uhh, WaPo was requesting crash data from NHTSA on driver assistance systems. Tesla is the only manufacturer trying to prevent that disclosure.

kjs3 1y ago

[flagged]

deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
bdcravens 1y ago
The "We'll wait" isn't really seen as effective discourse here like it on on Reddit/Twitter. Just state your argument and let it stand on its own without the perceived "mic drop".

duxup 1y ago

I agree, although that's more about the request(er) than anything else.

ra7 1y ago

Crash data for all other ADAS systems is already public [1]. The only manufacturer with heavily redacted information in that data to the point of being useless is Tesla. [1] https://www.nhtsa.gov/laws-regulations/standing-general-order-crash-reporting#data https://www.nhtsa.gov/laws-regulations/standing-general-orde...

andsoitis 1y ago
> The only manufacturer with heavily redacted information in that data to the point of being useless is Tesla. The nice thing is we can look for ourselves to what extent that is true by downloading the CSV: https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/ffdd/sgo-2021-01/SGO-2021-01_Incident_Reports_ADAS.csv https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/ffdd/sgo-2021-01/SGO-2021-01_In... For example, in the case of BMW, in every single case the field for ADS/ADAS Version is either blank or redacted.
- armsaw 1y ago
  When I look at this data, I see the type of self driving in use, as well as the written narrative of every crash, along with several other fields as REDACTED FOR BUSINESS REASONS, only for Tesla vehicles, where every other manufacturer seems to have these fields populated. To me, that information would be crucial to understanding what actually happened in each case, as opposed to only being able to understand some of the ambient conditions around each accident.
  - andsoitis 1y ago
    > REDACTED FOR BUSINESS REASONS, only for Tesla vehicles, where every other manufacturer seems to have these fields populated. Not true. There are many rows for other manufacturers where fields are redacted or blank. For example: - Row 7. BMW. ADAS/ADS Version: blank - Row 8. BMW. ADAS/ADS Version: redacted - Row 9. Subaru. ADAS/ADS Version: redacted etc.
    - armsaw 1y ago
      Granted there are some other rows with missing or incomplete information, but Tesla appears to be the only manufacturer for which this information is withheld in every single instance without exception.
      - andsoitis 1y ago
        > Granted there are some other rows with missing or incomplete information, but Tesla appears to be the only manufacturer for which this information is withheld in every single instance without exception. Again, not true. I just filtered for BMW, and in every single instance, without fail, the ADS/ADAS Version cell is either redacted or blank. I didn't check other manufacturers.
        zimpenfish 1y ago
        Did a quick check and yeah, there's a lot of redaction/blanks in `ADAS/ADS System Version` Rpts RdBl Pcage Entity 48 12 25.00 Ford Motor Company 18 6 33.33 Rivian Automotive, LLC 10 4 40.00 Volkswagen Group of America, Inc. 29 12 41.38 Mercedes-Benz USA, LLC 38 18 47.37 Lucid USA, Inc. 27 15 55.56 Hyundai Motor America 37 22 59.46 Kia America, Inc. 6 4 66.67 APTIV 6 5 83.33 Porsche Cars North America, Inc. 12 10 83.33 Daimler Trucks North America, LLC 159 156 98.11 Honda (American Honda Motor Co.) 126 124 98.41 Subaru of America, Inc. 3003 3001 99.93 Tesla, Inc. 1 1 100.00 Nuro 2 2 100.00 Mazda North American Operations 6 6 100.00 Chrysler (FCA US, LLC) 71 71 100.00 BMW of North America, LLC
bumby 1y ago
Not “all” crash data, though. >and the crash involves a vulnerable road user being struck or results in a fatality, an air bag deployment, or any individual being transported to a hospital for medical treatment.
- ra7 1y ago
  This was a recent change by the current administration to loosen previously stricter data reporting requirements: https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/us-agency-ease-self-driving-vehicle-deployment-hurdles-retain-reporting-rules-2025-04-24/ https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/us-age...
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]

deleted 1y ago

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