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I mean there is lots of worthless regulation. The Beneficial Ownership Information (BOI) form is new as of last year, and adds complexity to company formation w

I mean there is lots of worthless regulation. The Beneficial Ownership Information (BOI) form is new as of last year, and adds complexity to company formation while also risking tanking the company if you don't fill it out properly. The real-world upside is basically nil, despite their promises of fraud prevention. Lots of these laws exist, and they stifle innovation. We're approaching a point where you need a lawyer and document service for a company formation, and these laws prevent small companies from attempting formation and can kill growing companies.

JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> risking tanking the company if you don't fill it out properly Source? I thought it’s a best efforts form.
- trollbridge 1y ago
  Company-ending fines plus threat of prison time.
- guywithahat 1y ago
  My understanding was you could have to pay 500 a day (inflation adjusted to ~600) for each day you're late. That's a quarter million after a little over a year. When I last incorporated with stripe atlas they told me I had to do it, although maybe they just wanted an extra fee. Either way I maintain this sort of thing adds complexity and makes it hard for people to start businesses who are experts in things other than incorporation law
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    > you could have to pay 500 a day (inflation adjusted to ~600) for each day you're late. That's a quarter million after a little over a year That’s not filling it out improperly, it’s forgetting to file. I’m also not familiar with any cases where this fine was unfairly applied. (I agree with you that BOI is as over broad as it’s badly named.)
    - guywithahat 1y ago
      Well the BOI went into effect in 2024, so I wouldn’t be surprised if nothing has happened. The concern is in 10 years, when someone decides to “crack down” on “corrupt” business and fine small companies millions of dollars. I know it’s fun to hate crypto (much of it is a scam) but this is essentially what the SEC and Biden admin did to them. It’s a quiet law that has potential to explode, and I was quite scared of it when I incorporated.
BrenBarn 1y ago
The way to resolve those problems is to make the penalties steeply progressive, not based on the "size of the company" but on the wealth of those beneficial owners. The reason "little tech" is a misnomer is that a company with a VC firehose behind it isn't little in any meaningful sense. If Andreessen is giving you millions of dollars and you don't file your forms right, Andreessen should have to pay a large fine. If they don't like that then they can stop funding companies and then companies can succeed or fail on their own merits rather than on how well they can convince some VC people to open their wallets.
octo888 1y ago
It's funny how sometimes it seems countries move in lockstep. Just two years later the UK introduced similar legislation to require verification of company directors among other things like banning PO Boxes. And the deadlines for compliance are in the same year (this year).
pjc50 1y ago
https://www.fincen.gov/boi https://www.fincen.gov/boi > [Updated March 26, 2025]: All entities created in the United States — including those previously known as “domestic reporting companies” — and their beneficial owners are now exempt from the requirement to report beneficial ownership information (BOI) to FinCEN. It was an anti-money-laundering thing, and money laundering is back in. Once again you can create US companies which are owned blindly by Cayman companies whose beneficial owners are either (a) sanctioned or (b) US nationals who don't want to pay tax.

JumpCrisscross 1y ago

> risking tanking the company if you don't fill it out properly Source? I thought it’s a best efforts form.

trollbridge 1y ago
Company-ending fines plus threat of prison time.
guywithahat 1y ago
My understanding was you could have to pay 500 a day (inflation adjusted to ~600) for each day you're late. That's a quarter million after a little over a year. When I last incorporated with stripe atlas they told me I had to do it, although maybe they just wanted an extra fee. Either way I maintain this sort of thing adds complexity and makes it hard for people to start businesses who are experts in things other than incorporation law
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > you could have to pay 500 a day (inflation adjusted to ~600) for each day you're late. That's a quarter million after a little over a year That’s not filling it out improperly, it’s forgetting to file. I’m also not familiar with any cases where this fine was unfairly applied. (I agree with you that BOI is as over broad as it’s badly named.)
  - guywithahat 1y ago
    Well the BOI went into effect in 2024, so I wouldn’t be surprised if nothing has happened. The concern is in 10 years, when someone decides to “crack down” on “corrupt” business and fine small companies millions of dollars. I know it’s fun to hate crypto (much of it is a scam) but this is essentially what the SEC and Biden admin did to them. It’s a quiet law that has potential to explode, and I was quite scared of it when I incorporated.

BrenBarn 1y ago

The way to resolve those problems is to make the penalties steeply progressive, not based on the "size of the company" but on the wealth of those beneficial owners. The reason "little tech" is a misnomer is that a company with a VC firehose behind it isn't little in any meaningful sense. If Andreessen is giving you millions of dollars and you don't file your forms right, Andreessen should have to pay a large fine. If they don't like that then they can stop funding companies and then companies can succeed or fail on their own merits rather than on how well they can convince some VC people to open their wallets.

octo888 1y ago

It's funny how sometimes it seems countries move in lockstep. Just two years later the UK introduced similar legislation to require verification of company directors among other things like banning PO Boxes. And the deadlines for compliance are in the same year (this year).

pjc50 1y ago

https://www.fincen.gov/boi https://www.fincen.gov/boi > [Updated March 26, 2025]: All entities created in the United States — including those previously known as “domestic reporting companies” — and their beneficial owners are now exempt from the requirement to report beneficial ownership information (BOI) to FinCEN. It was an anti-money-laundering thing, and money laundering is back in. Once again you can create US companies which are owned blindly by Cayman companies whose beneficial owners are either (a) sanctioned or (b) US nationals who don't want to pay tax.