5 ms·

How to tear down the walls of your echo chamber

60 points by cdevroe 14y ago

cdevroe 14y ago
I'd love to know if the HN community has any other tips to add to this list that I've jotted down.
- delano 14y ago
  Great list. I'd add: rather than ask someone what they do, ask them what they enjoy doing.
  - cdevroe 14y ago
    delano: I love that. I'll add it to my post soon.
  - bstpierre 14y ago
    That's an excellent suggestion -- good way to change up a tired conversation starter. My addition to the list would be to learn/practice something that you find frustrating or just don't know well. E.g. I know C/C++/python well, but I'm a terrible javascript programmer, so I could "de-echo" by learning JS and listening to some of the things coming out of the community. Going broader, I try to do achieve some larger (or smaller) non-programming project on a regular basis -- build something, grow fruits & vegetables, learn the Cyrillic alphabet (as an example of something smaller), etc.
- deleted 14y ago
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- deleted 14y ago
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cek 14y ago
Good list. Add to it: Get out of the building and talk to customers. Real customers. In other parts of the world.
- cdevroe 14y ago
  Another great addition. The company I work for, Viddler, has been doing that a lot more recently. Actually visiting our customers in their offices or in "the field" in which they work to really learn how they use our product. And it has been a boon of product information for us.
- apr 14y ago
  This is a good suggestion if only a bit vague. How exactly do you do that?
- cdevroe 14y ago
  apr: How about simply scheduling meetings with your customers and asking them how they use your product, what they need, and how your company can help them with their goals.
blendergasket 14y ago
One thing I like to do is try to start conversations with people who believe very different things than I do. For a while I was doing weekly bible readings with a very interesting group of Christian people (I'm not Christian and have never been religious). It got heated. I was very challenged and forced to analyze my own beliefs and the presuppositions I brought to the table. I'm sure they felt that they had to do the same as well and I think we all became better people for it.
- jeremyt 14y ago
  My experience has been this is a recipe for becoming an admirably open, yet unlikable person. I'm actually in the process of heading in the other direction. In fact, I think that I recently lost a budding friendship because of a heated political discussion.
  - the_cat_kittles 14y ago
    Sorry to hear that, but its been my experience that a friendship that gets tripped up by relatively superficial differences like that is probably not a strong friendship to begin with. I am not old, but the older I get, the less I feel like religion and politics are relevant to a person's personality. At the risk of trivializing them too much, I almost think of them as a team allegiance like rooting for the Packers vs the Steelers... While there are consequences for what people believe, in terms of a friendship, these things really don't matter to me.
    - jeremyt 14y ago
      Well, in my defense I did say it was a "budding friendship". However, I literally have never had a positive experience discussing religion or politics, except with people with whom I already agree. I have a personal rule to never do so, and I've even attempted to apply that to the Internet and failed on several occasions. Yet, I regret having tried in each case.
      - blendergasket 14y ago
ZanderEarth32 14y ago
Good list, but what's with the "What 90% Less TV" quip? I get it, TV is an idiot box, there's nothing good on, blah blah. But not all TV is equal. Does this include content you actively seek out on Netflix or some other on-demand service that you happen to view on your TV? This appears as another, "I don't even own a tv" kind of elitism advice. Without a reason as to why I should stop watching so much tv, or even a basis for the seemingly arbitrary 90% number I can't take this advice with any kind of seriousness.
- timjahn 14y ago
  I can't stand this either. People constantly blame the medium (TV) but in reality, it's (some of) the content that's bad, not the medium. There is plenty of good television out there. I enjoy watching certain TV more than others, for various reasons. Sometimes it's to learn, sometime it's for relaxation. Where does it stop? Are movies bad too? They're just like TV, except (usually) on a bigger screen and longer. What about theatrical plays? Are those making me dumber too? </rant>
  - ZanderEarth32 14y ago
    And why even stop with only visual mediums, why is listening to music any more fulfilling or beneficial than watching a 30 minute sitcom? This might really come down to passive viewing versus active viewing,where in the passive case you're just sitting there flipping channels to pass the time, consuming whatever is presented to you. This isn't inherently a bad thing though. If it is relaxing or enjoyable to you, then there is no reason to stop. Not everything you do in life needs to improve you as a person on some deep level. Sometimes, sitting there twiddling your thumbs to relax or recharge is just as beneficial as reading, learning, growing, coding, building, shipping, etc.
    - timjahn 14y ago
      "Sometimes, sitting there twiddling your thumbs to relax or recharge is just as beneficial as reading, learning, growing, coding, building, shipping, etc." Exactly.
jacoblyles 14y ago
How about watch more TV? None of the people I know in Silicon Valley watch the top 10 shows in America, among those that even have a TV! When I go home for the holidays I get an education in how the rest of the country thinks through the television.
- cdevroe 14y ago
  Besides seeing what other people are watching I simply do not see much value in the top 10 shows on TV in the US.
  - jessedhillon 14y ago
    So your post is about broadening your experience, but you're dismissing TV because it's only use is to show you what other people are experiencing? I'm not a big TV watcher, but I would certainly say there's some value to a walled in, introverted person in figuring out why "American Idol" or "Two And A Half Men" are some of the most popular shows in the US. Most people around here just assume it's because everyone else is a dumbass. BTW: http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/once.html http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/once.html
dorkusprime 14y ago
Go to Burning Man. Along with the outrageously friendly crowd willing to strike up conversations about anything, it's has the greatest density of diversity that I've ever seen. In one day, you could easily discuss politics with Republicans, Democrats, moderates, and extremists; religion with Atheists, Muslims, Buddhists, and Christians; and science with research scientists, conspiracy theorists, and mystics.
te_platt 14y ago
How about have kids? My kids are constantly challenging me to reexamine why I do the things I do. More so challenging me to explain why I make them do the things I make them do. Not to mention introducing me to new music (I get to introduce them to my music too) and shows.
- jmj42 14y ago
  I can't up vote this enough. Things from _way_ outside of my confort zone, just from the last week due to my kids (I have 2 teenage girls): Coaching Softball (I generally dislike base/softball) Sewing Marathon training teenage interpersonal relationships Kids are great for new experiences. Especially if you encourage _them_ to take on new experiences, invariably you will also get to experience new things.
  - agumonkey 14y ago
    Parent/Children interactions are a bit sci-fi to me. Completely modern foreign for both.
the_cat_kittles 14y ago
I think learning a new language might be a big gateway too
001sky 14y ago
+1 Project: How to turn an echo-chamber into a concert hall =) (Ask HN?)
RyanMcGreal 14y ago
> It is good to know what’s new. But don’t forget to learn from the past or from something new. I have a feeling this post was dashed off rather than thought through.

60 points by cdevroe 14y ago

cdevroe 14y ago

I'd love to know if the HN community has any other tips to add to this list that I've jotted down.

delano 14y ago
Great list. I'd add: rather than ask someone what they do, ask them what they enjoy doing.
- cdevroe 14y ago
  delano: I love that. I'll add it to my post soon.
- bstpierre 14y ago
  That's an excellent suggestion -- good way to change up a tired conversation starter. My addition to the list would be to learn/practice something that you find frustrating or just don't know well. E.g. I know C/C++/python well, but I'm a terrible javascript programmer, so I could "de-echo" by learning JS and listening to some of the things coming out of the community. Going broader, I try to do achieve some larger (or smaller) non-programming project on a regular basis -- build something, grow fruits & vegetables, learn the Cyrillic alphabet (as an example of something smaller), etc.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

cek 14y ago

Good list. Add to it: Get out of the building and talk to customers. Real customers. In other parts of the world.

cdevroe 14y ago
Another great addition. The company I work for, Viddler, has been doing that a lot more recently. Actually visiting our customers in their offices or in "the field" in which they work to really learn how they use our product. And it has been a boon of product information for us.
apr 14y ago
This is a good suggestion if only a bit vague. How exactly do you do that?
cdevroe 14y ago
apr: How about simply scheduling meetings with your customers and asking them how they use your product, what they need, and how your company can help them with their goals.

blendergasket 14y ago

One thing I like to do is try to start conversations with people who believe very different things than I do. For a while I was doing weekly bible readings with a very interesting group of Christian people (I'm not Christian and have never been religious). It got heated. I was very challenged and forced to analyze my own beliefs and the presuppositions I brought to the table. I'm sure they felt that they had to do the same as well and I think we all became better people for it.

jeremyt 14y ago
My experience has been this is a recipe for becoming an admirably open, yet unlikable person. I'm actually in the process of heading in the other direction. In fact, I think that I recently lost a budding friendship because of a heated political discussion.
- the_cat_kittles 14y ago
  Sorry to hear that, but its been my experience that a friendship that gets tripped up by relatively superficial differences like that is probably not a strong friendship to begin with. I am not old, but the older I get, the less I feel like religion and politics are relevant to a person's personality. At the risk of trivializing them too much, I almost think of them as a team allegiance like rooting for the Packers vs the Steelers... While there are consequences for what people believe, in terms of a friendship, these things really don't matter to me.
  - jeremyt 14y ago
    Well, in my defense I did say it was a "budding friendship". However, I literally have never had a positive experience discussing religion or politics, except with people with whom I already agree. I have a personal rule to never do so, and I've even attempted to apply that to the Internet and failed on several occasions. Yet, I regret having tried in each case.
    - blendergasket 14y ago

ZanderEarth32 14y ago

Good list, but what's with the "What 90% Less TV" quip? I get it, TV is an idiot box, there's nothing good on, blah blah. But not all TV is equal. Does this include content you actively seek out on Netflix or some other on-demand service that you happen to view on your TV? This appears as another, "I don't even own a tv" kind of elitism advice. Without a reason as to why I should stop watching so much tv, or even a basis for the seemingly arbitrary 90% number I can't take this advice with any kind of seriousness.

timjahn 14y ago
I can't stand this either. People constantly blame the medium (TV) but in reality, it's (some of) the content that's bad, not the medium. There is plenty of good television out there. I enjoy watching certain TV more than others, for various reasons. Sometimes it's to learn, sometime it's for relaxation. Where does it stop? Are movies bad too? They're just like TV, except (usually) on a bigger screen and longer. What about theatrical plays? Are those making me dumber too? </rant>
- ZanderEarth32 14y ago
  And why even stop with only visual mediums, why is listening to music any more fulfilling or beneficial than watching a 30 minute sitcom? This might really come down to passive viewing versus active viewing,where in the passive case you're just sitting there flipping channels to pass the time, consuming whatever is presented to you. This isn't inherently a bad thing though. If it is relaxing or enjoyable to you, then there is no reason to stop. Not everything you do in life needs to improve you as a person on some deep level. Sometimes, sitting there twiddling your thumbs to relax or recharge is just as beneficial as reading, learning, growing, coding, building, shipping, etc.
  - timjahn 14y ago
    "Sometimes, sitting there twiddling your thumbs to relax or recharge is just as beneficial as reading, learning, growing, coding, building, shipping, etc." Exactly.

jacoblyles 14y ago

How about watch more TV? None of the people I know in Silicon Valley watch the top 10 shows in America, among those that even have a TV! When I go home for the holidays I get an education in how the rest of the country thinks through the television.

cdevroe 14y ago
Besides seeing what other people are watching I simply do not see much value in the top 10 shows on TV in the US.
- jessedhillon 14y ago
  So your post is about broadening your experience, but you're dismissing TV because it's only use is to show you what other people are experiencing? I'm not a big TV watcher, but I would certainly say there's some value to a walled in, introverted person in figuring out why "American Idol" or "Two And A Half Men" are some of the most popular shows in the US. Most people around here just assume it's because everyone else is a dumbass. BTW: http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/once.html http://public.wsu.edu/~brians/errors/once.html

dorkusprime 14y ago

Go to Burning Man. Along with the outrageously friendly crowd willing to strike up conversations about anything, it's has the greatest density of diversity that I've ever seen. In one day, you could easily discuss politics with Republicans, Democrats, moderates, and extremists; religion with Atheists, Muslims, Buddhists, and Christians; and science with research scientists, conspiracy theorists, and mystics.

te_platt 14y ago

How about have kids? My kids are constantly challenging me to reexamine why I do the things I do. More so challenging me to explain why I make them do the things I make them do. Not to mention introducing me to new music (I get to introduce them to my music too) and shows.

jmj42 14y ago
I can't up vote this enough. Things from _way_ outside of my confort zone, just from the last week due to my kids (I have 2 teenage girls): Coaching Softball (I generally dislike base/softball) Sewing Marathon training teenage interpersonal relationships Kids are great for new experiences. Especially if you encourage _them_ to take on new experiences, invariably you will also get to experience new things.
- agumonkey 14y ago
  Parent/Children interactions are a bit sci-fi to me. Completely modern foreign for both.

the_cat_kittles 14y ago

I think learning a new language might be a big gateway too

001sky 14y ago

+1 Project: How to turn an echo-chamber into a concert hall =) (Ask HN?)

RyanMcGreal 14y ago

> It is good to know what’s new. But don’t forget to learn from the past or from something new. I have a feeling this post was dashed off rather than thought through.