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India used oldschool L70 Guns, zu 23 and ZSU-23-4 Shilka against pakisthan's drone swarm attacks. They are modernized to track, lock, and fire automatically. Bu

India used oldschool L70 Guns, zu 23 and ZSU-23-4 Shilka against pakisthan's drone swarm attacks. They are modernized to track, lock, and fire automatically. But they are cheap.

cenamus 1y ago
What kinda targeting system do they use? Probably no significant IR signature and radar one's pretty small aswell?
- sreekanth850 1y ago
  We have multi-layered low signature and passive drone detection system, including radar, radio frequency (RF)-based systems, electro-optical sensors, IR, and video tracking. We also have Thermal imaging for all weather use. And all are integrated into a single command and control system. These upgraded Old school system proved to be worthy to shot down more than 500 turkish drones sent by Pak.
  - petra 1y ago
    What was the kill rate of this system ?
    - sreekanth850 1y ago
      None of them caused any casualities or any damage to infrastructure. As we have multi layered defense system with L70 and Zu23 for very short range Defense agains drones and UAV, Spyder for Short Range, Akash for Medium range, s400 for Long range and high value target, exact kill rate of Guns are unknown. In press briefing, officials said that these were so effective against drones.
      - petra 1y ago
        That's very impressive, especially at low cost.
        sreekanth850 1y ago
        Yes, Cost is the main factor, one cannot use expensive air defense to shot down drones that are relatively cheap.
        sreekanth850 1y ago
        https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/defence/in-operation-sindoor-akashteer-played-the-most-crucial-role-army-explains-how-it-struck-down-every-drone-with-100-kill-rate/articleshow/121274743.cms https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/defence/in-operati...
  - cenamus 1y ago
    Ah so more like traditional, larger drones with gas engines/turbines, as opposed to the quadcopters?
- ahartmetz 1y ago
  The strength of a reflected radar signal generally decreases with the fourth power of distance: r-squared to the reflector, and r-squared back from the reflector (assuming more-or-less uniform backscattering). Which means that a low radar signature is usually still detectable, the object just needs to get moderately closer. So being stealthy in the radar spectrum is pretty difficult, and I often wonder if stealth planes are mostly a means to transfer money from the state to defense companies.
potato3732842 1y ago
There hasn't been much coverage because it's not as sexy as drones but the degree to which AA tech that was formerly the domain of well funded armies has proliferated down the economic spectrum in recent years is really hard to overstate.
- sreekanth850 1y ago
  Exactly, one cannot use patriot or s400 to dhot down drones, they are way expensive compared to a cheaper UAV.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
- dragonwriter 1y ago
  > There hasn't been much coverage because it's not as sexy as drones but the degree to which AA tech that was formerly the domain of well funded armies has proliferated down the economic spectrum in recent years is really hard to overstate. A lot of the key AA tech that has suddenly become important in the era of drone swarms began proliferating to mid-tier forces around the 1980s (or earlier), and was retired by well-funded armies between then and the 2000s, because compared to SAM systems, it was suitable only for lower, slower, less capable targets. Turns out, suddenly large numbers of lower, slower, less capable targets are being fielded, and its really expensive to take them on with SAM systems optimized for dealing with modern manned aircraft, cruise missiles, and/or ballistic missiles.
pjc50 1y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bofors_40_mm_Automatic_Gun_L/70 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bofors_40_mm_Automatic_Gun_L/7... Immediate post-WW2 vintage. The classic design of AA gun. As far as I understand it from talking about Turkish drones, you mean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayraktar_TB2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayraktar_TB2 style, aircraft size drones, rather than the quadcopter size ones? The latter can more easily hide in terrain.
- sreekanth850 1y ago
  Asisguard Songar drones.
  - pjc50 1y ago
    Ah, thanks for the detail.

India used oldschool L70 Guns, zu 23 and ZSU-23-4 Shilka against pakisthan's drone swarm attacks. They are modernized to track, lock, and fire automatically. But they are cheap.

cenamus 1y ago

What kinda targeting system do they use? Probably no significant IR signature and radar one's pretty small aswell?

sreekanth850 1y ago
We have multi-layered low signature and passive drone detection system, including radar, radio frequency (RF)-based systems, electro-optical sensors, IR, and video tracking. We also have Thermal imaging for all weather use. And all are integrated into a single command and control system. These upgraded Old school system proved to be worthy to shot down more than 500 turkish drones sent by Pak.
- petra 1y ago
  What was the kill rate of this system ?
  - sreekanth850 1y ago
    None of them caused any casualities or any damage to infrastructure. As we have multi layered defense system with L70 and Zu23 for very short range Defense agains drones and UAV, Spyder for Short Range, Akash for Medium range, s400 for Long range and high value target, exact kill rate of Guns are unknown. In press briefing, officials said that these were so effective against drones.
    - petra 1y ago
      That's very impressive, especially at low cost.
      - sreekanth850 1y ago
        Yes, Cost is the main factor, one cannot use expensive air defense to shot down drones that are relatively cheap.
      - sreekanth850 1y ago
        https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/defence/in-operation-sindoor-akashteer-played-the-most-crucial-role-army-explains-how-it-struck-down-every-drone-with-100-kill-rate/articleshow/121274743.cms https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/defence/in-operati...
- cenamus 1y ago
  Ah so more like traditional, larger drones with gas engines/turbines, as opposed to the quadcopters?
ahartmetz 1y ago
The strength of a reflected radar signal generally decreases with the fourth power of distance: r-squared to the reflector, and r-squared back from the reflector (assuming more-or-less uniform backscattering). Which means that a low radar signature is usually still detectable, the object just needs to get moderately closer. So being stealthy in the radar spectrum is pretty difficult, and I often wonder if stealth planes are mostly a means to transfer money from the state to defense companies.

potato3732842 1y ago

There hasn't been much coverage because it's not as sexy as drones but the degree to which AA tech that was formerly the domain of well funded armies has proliferated down the economic spectrum in recent years is really hard to overstate.

sreekanth850 1y ago
Exactly, one cannot use patriot or s400 to dhot down drones, they are way expensive compared to a cheaper UAV.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
dragonwriter 1y ago
> There hasn't been much coverage because it's not as sexy as drones but the degree to which AA tech that was formerly the domain of well funded armies has proliferated down the economic spectrum in recent years is really hard to overstate. A lot of the key AA tech that has suddenly become important in the era of drone swarms began proliferating to mid-tier forces around the 1980s (or earlier), and was retired by well-funded armies between then and the 2000s, because compared to SAM systems, it was suitable only for lower, slower, less capable targets. Turns out, suddenly large numbers of lower, slower, less capable targets are being fielded, and its really expensive to take them on with SAM systems optimized for dealing with modern manned aircraft, cruise missiles, and/or ballistic missiles.

pjc50 1y ago

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bofors_40_mm_Automatic_Gun_L/70 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bofors_40_mm_Automatic_Gun_L/7... Immediate post-WW2 vintage. The classic design of AA gun. As far as I understand it from talking about Turkish drones, you mean https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayraktar_TB2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bayraktar_TB2 style, aircraft size drones, rather than the quadcopter size ones? The latter can more easily hide in terrain.

sreekanth850 1y ago
Asisguard Songar drones.
- pjc50 1y ago
  Ah, thanks for the detail.