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I’m not saying it’s a good solution, but the problem itself is real enough. As others have noted, I’ve had more close calls with dangerous e-bike riders as a pe

I’m not saying it’s a good solution, but the problem itself is real enough. As others have noted, I’ve had more close calls with dangerous e-bike riders as a pedestrian than I’ve ever had with cars, mostly because riders behave as if they’re not piloting a powered vehicle capable of doing quite a bit of harm. Whether or not it’s actually making pedestrians safer is an open question. If the threat of a court date actually leads to less dangerous behavior by riders, it’s entirely possible that it could make pedestrians safer. That still wouldn’t be sufficient to conclude it’s a good policy. Another approach would be to level the playing field between drivers and riders and use the same enforcement policies/mechanisms for both, but that also has side effects that people would not like.

sagarm 1y ago
The cops are harassing all cyclists, ebike or no.
- haswell 1y ago
  As a cyclist, the number of other cyclists I see doing utterly stupid and dumb things that are a direct violation of the rules of the road and put pedestrians at risk...is a very high number. E-bikes are often even more dangerous because of their speed and additional weight, but I've often wished the cops in my city would actually go after cyclists more often. Like I mentioned above, whether or not the solution described in the article is a good way to do this is another question. But I don't see an issue with them going after rule-breaking cylists regardless of bike type.
  - sagarm 1y ago
    Look, DoorDashers on mopeds on sidewalks are annoying, but drivers in NYC kill hundreds, maim thousands, and hit tens of thousands every year. Add to that the fact that NYPD is NOT focusing on dangerous behaviors or mopeds, and it's clear that NYPD enforcement priorities are misplaced. The equivalent to ticketing a cyclist proceeding safely through an intersection without the light would be ticketing drivers for blocking the box, rolling through stop signs, making a right on red without coming to a complete stop, double parking or parking in bike lanes, or going 1mph over the posted limit.
    - haswell 1y ago
      > DoorDashers on mopeds on sidewalks are annoying No, they’re dangerous. > but drivers in NYC kill hundreds, maim thousands, and hit tens of thousands every year. This strikes me as an argument from whataboutism. I don’t have the stats, but I strongly suspect that the volume of cars is also significantly higher than the volume of bikes on top of the size/weight difference, so it is not surprising that the numbers are significantly higher. This doesn’t make the status quo with dangerous behavior on bikes ok to ignore. Here in Chicago, I’ve been clipped by a bike while walking on the sidewalk, hit by a drunk cyclist while riding my bike, causing me to crash, and witness stupid close calls and ridiculous behavior on a daily basis. I’ve had more close encounters with bikes as a pedestrian than I’ve ever had with cars. Clearly the stats show that vehicle deaths are far greater, but again, this is a numbers thing, and not a valid reason to ignore bike safety. > Add to that the fact that NYPD is NOT focusing on dangerous behaviors or mopeds Running red lights is dangerous. Period. The fact that many cyclists do it without causing an accident doesn’t make it less dangerous. And I disagree that the police aren’t targeting dangerous behaviors here. If the goal is to stop rule violations by people who are doing dangerous things, that necessarily involves going after the people engaged in obvious rule violations. Think about this from an enforcement perspective: if I see someone run a red that causes an oncoming driver with the right of way to slow down to avoid a collision, that’s pretty obviously a problem and worth citing. But the line between “dangerous” and “safe” is often not clear cut, and so it doesn’t seem unreasonable to target rule violations across the board if the goal is to achieve a major behavior change among cyclists. > The equivalent to ticketing a cyclist proceeding safely through an intersection without the light Except most cyclists who run red lights do not do so safely, and I think this is a poor characterization of the issue and risk. To reiterate an earlier point, I’m not sure I’m a fan of the how here, i.e. threatening people with an arrest warrant feels heavy handed. But I also understand why to some degree. I’m tempted to say I’d prefer some kind of law change such that riders have similar legal responsibility to respond to citations as drivers, but I also am not a fan of some of the potential implications of that, e.g. I don’t want bicycle licenses to become a thing. I’m curious how you’d address the issue, if you can acknowledge for a moment that there is indeed a real issue that needs to be addressed.
      - 1y ago

sagarm 1y ago

The cops are harassing all cyclists, ebike or no.

haswell 1y ago
As a cyclist, the number of other cyclists I see doing utterly stupid and dumb things that are a direct violation of the rules of the road and put pedestrians at risk...is a very high number. E-bikes are often even more dangerous because of their speed and additional weight, but I've often wished the cops in my city would actually go after cyclists more often. Like I mentioned above, whether or not the solution described in the article is a good way to do this is another question. But I don't see an issue with them going after rule-breaking cylists regardless of bike type.
- sagarm 1y ago
  Look, DoorDashers on mopeds on sidewalks are annoying, but drivers in NYC kill hundreds, maim thousands, and hit tens of thousands every year. Add to that the fact that NYPD is NOT focusing on dangerous behaviors or mopeds, and it's clear that NYPD enforcement priorities are misplaced. The equivalent to ticketing a cyclist proceeding safely through an intersection without the light would be ticketing drivers for blocking the box, rolling through stop signs, making a right on red without coming to a complete stop, double parking or parking in bike lanes, or going 1mph over the posted limit.
  - haswell 1y ago
    > DoorDashers on mopeds on sidewalks are annoying No, they’re dangerous. > but drivers in NYC kill hundreds, maim thousands, and hit tens of thousands every year. This strikes me as an argument from whataboutism. I don’t have the stats, but I strongly suspect that the volume of cars is also significantly higher than the volume of bikes on top of the size/weight difference, so it is not surprising that the numbers are significantly higher. This doesn’t make the status quo with dangerous behavior on bikes ok to ignore. Here in Chicago, I’ve been clipped by a bike while walking on the sidewalk, hit by a drunk cyclist while riding my bike, causing me to crash, and witness stupid close calls and ridiculous behavior on a daily basis. I’ve had more close encounters with bikes as a pedestrian than I’ve ever had with cars. Clearly the stats show that vehicle deaths are far greater, but again, this is a numbers thing, and not a valid reason to ignore bike safety. > Add to that the fact that NYPD is NOT focusing on dangerous behaviors or mopeds Running red lights is dangerous. Period. The fact that many cyclists do it without causing an accident doesn’t make it less dangerous. And I disagree that the police aren’t targeting dangerous behaviors here. If the goal is to stop rule violations by people who are doing dangerous things, that necessarily involves going after the people engaged in obvious rule violations. Think about this from an enforcement perspective: if I see someone run a red that causes an oncoming driver with the right of way to slow down to avoid a collision, that’s pretty obviously a problem and worth citing. But the line between “dangerous” and “safe” is often not clear cut, and so it doesn’t seem unreasonable to target rule violations across the board if the goal is to achieve a major behavior change among cyclists. > The equivalent to ticketing a cyclist proceeding safely through an intersection without the light Except most cyclists who run red lights do not do so safely, and I think this is a poor characterization of the issue and risk. To reiterate an earlier point, I’m not sure I’m a fan of the how here, i.e. threatening people with an arrest warrant feels heavy handed. But I also understand why to some degree. I’m tempted to say I’d prefer some kind of law change such that riders have similar legal responsibility to respond to citations as drivers, but I also am not a fan of some of the potential implications of that, e.g. I don’t want bicycle licenses to become a thing. I’m curious how you’d address the issue, if you can acknowledge for a moment that there is indeed a real issue that needs to be addressed.
    - 1y ago