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There are no "Math Wars!" There is only the Khan Academy, doing great stuff, and a group of disgruntled, jealous math teachers such as the author of this post,

There are no "Math Wars!" There is only the Khan Academy, doing great stuff, and a group of disgruntled, jealous math teachers such as the author of this post, who have levied silly, petty, baseless criticisms against the Khan Academy. After launching the silly criticisms and stirring up a little controversy (but by no means a "war"), they now want to cast the whole hullabaloo as a "war" because it glorifies their role in the whole thing. It's like a flea trying to recast his battle against the St. Benard he rides on as a "war." Khan Academy is doing great stuff, and getting great results right now. If you're a jealous math teacher who thinks you have better answers, then quit spewing a bunch of FUD-like rhetoric with no substance, and fucking DO SOMETHING to help some people learn math right now. If what you do is so much better than Khan Academy, then it will become obvious in short order. P.S. And by "help some people learn math right now", I don't mean your day job as a teacher/professor. Do something that helps improve the effectiveness of math education on a grand scale ... as Khan Academy is doing. P.P.S. The whole thing makes me grumpy as hell, and I'm sure that comes out. But the reason is this -- if the "math teachers" side of this "war" is so all-fired passionate about disrupting the status quo and raising the overall quality of math education in the world, then why on Earth would you take potshots at Khan Academy, who is doing so much towards that very goal??! If that truly was your goal, you'd celebrate and help. I think the potshots show that the greater motivation is jealousy that some outsider has gotten so much more traction on the problem so quickly.

dvse 14y ago
Have you checked the "Articles" section on betterexplained.com? Clearly the author of the article is trying to put his ideas into practice - not perfect but rather helpful in fostering something like actual understanding of topics that are all too often presented as a sequence of rote manipulations (more or less all of K12 and many "service" university courses follow this).
- charlieflowers 14y ago
  dvse, see my response to kalid. I thought "Math Wars" was a reference to a specific set of criticisms levied against Kahn Academy recently, when perhaps it was not a reference to that at all. If so, the whole thing could be a misunderstanding on my part. Waiting for kalid to clarify.
kalid 14y ago
Hi. I appreciate the comments and if you're open to it, I'd like to understand your point of view. The "Math Wars" actually reference a longstanding struggle about math education in the US (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Math_wars http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Math_wars). That allusion is more apparent to people in the field however. I thought I gave the debate a fair and nuanced treatment and I'm curious to see what specific points are silly or baseless. If it helps, I actually ran the essay by an online buddy at Khan Academy and he liked the tone and focus on solutions. So I'm very confused where your offense is coming from. I totally agree Khan Academy is doing great stuff right now (I recommend them often). Other educators are as well. The problem is the entire movement is not cohesive, and the entire online learning movement is losing the attention battle against individual pop stars. I don't believe quantity is a direct proxy for quality (see said pop stars), but if it helps: I've written among the most popular online tutorials for exponents, natural log, imaginary numbers, introduction to calculus, Bayes's theorem, Euler's theorem, radians, combinations and permutations... [just google for any of those topics]. They've collectively reached many millions of people and are used in dozens of courses.
- charlieflowers 14y ago
  OK, I appreciate your openness to understanding my point of view. I will articulate/respond respectfully. First, some quick points: 1. I must apologize for misinterpreting "Math Wars". I though it was referring to the recent little "skirmishes" between certain math professors and Khan Academy (as found here, for example: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/khan-academy-readers-weigh-in/2012/08/02/gJQA83rW9W_blog.html http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/khan-a...) 2. Your tutorials sound fantastic. I haven't had the pleasure of working through them, but they certainly sound like they are raising the level of worldwide math education. So, before I go any further, let me ask -- are you at all entangled with (or even on the periphery of) the skirmish referred to by the link I posted above, between Mathalicious founder Karim Kai Ani and Khan Academy? Or the skirmish triggered by some of Frank Noschese's criticisms, as in http://fnoschese.wordpress.com/2011/12/02/you-khant-ignore-how-students-learn/ http://fnoschese.wordpress.com/2011/12/02/you-khant-ignore-h... ? The reason I ask is because this is what I (perhaps mistakenly) though you were referring to, and it is many of these criticisms that I feel are baseless and petty. If those criticisms really have nothing to do with your current post or even your current mental outlook, then all that's left for me to do is apologize for jumping to conclusions and getting overheated for something that has nothing to do with you. If those criticism are relevant to your posting and current outlook, then perhaps it would make sense for me to continue onward by listing those criticisms that I feel are baseless. If so, I will proceed.
rimantas 14y ago
Disclaimer: I am not a math (or any other) teacher. I am trained as a teacher however. > Khan Academy is doing great stuff, Putting some videos of poor quality (technically and from the teaching point) does not "great stuff" make. It may be helpful to some, though. > and getting great results right now. Care to qualify, what those "great results" are and how the greatness is determined? I repeat myself: I am not a jealous teacher. I am just sad that KA is so overhyped and will have very little impact on education. How many times should it be said: when the problem is not technology, you won't save it with technology. And if someone wants invent effortless learning he then can start looking for philosopher's stone as well.
- charlieflowers 14y ago
  "Putting some videos of poor quality (technically and from the teaching point) does not "great stuff" make." That's ridiculous. Sure you can find some errors if you look hard. But overall, the videos are excellent. Many, many people have left comments saying how much the videos have helped them learn things they had previously struggled with. You want to label the whole work as "poor quality", which makes it obvious you're not being objective or rational. "Care to qualify, what those 'great results' are and how the greatness is determined?" Real people, who say they previously struggled with a concept or a topic, and now, thanks to these videos, they've had breakthroughs. (I'm sure there are other measurable results we could list as well, but this one is enough to shoot down your claims). "I am just sad that KA is so overhyped and will have very little impact on education." I completely agree that it is overhyped. I'm not sure it will have a huge impact on education ... only time will tell. But it is a fantastic asset that the world did not have until recently, and it has a chance to turn out to be significant. "when the problem is not technology, you won't save it with technology" True. But technology makes new things possible, and allows disruptions to occur. It is often a catalyst.

dvse 14y ago

Have you checked the "Articles" section on betterexplained.com? Clearly the author of the article is trying to put his ideas into practice - not perfect but rather helpful in fostering something like actual understanding of topics that are all too often presented as a sequence of rote manipulations (more or less all of K12 and many "service" university courses follow this).

charlieflowers 14y ago
dvse, see my response to kalid. I thought "Math Wars" was a reference to a specific set of criticisms levied against Kahn Academy recently, when perhaps it was not a reference to that at all. If so, the whole thing could be a misunderstanding on my part. Waiting for kalid to clarify.

kalid 14y ago

Hi. I appreciate the comments and if you're open to it, I'd like to understand your point of view. The "Math Wars" actually reference a longstanding struggle about math education in the US (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Math_wars http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Math_wars). That allusion is more apparent to people in the field however. I thought I gave the debate a fair and nuanced treatment and I'm curious to see what specific points are silly or baseless. If it helps, I actually ran the essay by an online buddy at Khan Academy and he liked the tone and focus on solutions. So I'm very confused where your offense is coming from. I totally agree Khan Academy is doing great stuff right now (I recommend them often). Other educators are as well. The problem is the entire movement is not cohesive, and the entire online learning movement is losing the attention battle against individual pop stars. I don't believe quantity is a direct proxy for quality (see said pop stars), but if it helps: I've written among the most popular online tutorials for exponents, natural log, imaginary numbers, introduction to calculus, Bayes's theorem, Euler's theorem, radians, combinations and permutations... [just google for any of those topics]. They've collectively reached many millions of people and are used in dozens of courses.

charlieflowers 14y ago
OK, I appreciate your openness to understanding my point of view. I will articulate/respond respectfully. First, some quick points: 1. I must apologize for misinterpreting "Math Wars". I though it was referring to the recent little "skirmishes" between certain math professors and Khan Academy (as found here, for example: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/khan-academy-readers-weigh-in/2012/08/02/gJQA83rW9W_blog.html http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/post/khan-a...) 2. Your tutorials sound fantastic. I haven't had the pleasure of working through them, but they certainly sound like they are raising the level of worldwide math education. So, before I go any further, let me ask -- are you at all entangled with (or even on the periphery of) the skirmish referred to by the link I posted above, between Mathalicious founder Karim Kai Ani and Khan Academy? Or the skirmish triggered by some of Frank Noschese's criticisms, as in http://fnoschese.wordpress.com/2011/12/02/you-khant-ignore-how-students-learn/ http://fnoschese.wordpress.com/2011/12/02/you-khant-ignore-h... ? The reason I ask is because this is what I (perhaps mistakenly) though you were referring to, and it is many of these criticisms that I feel are baseless and petty. If those criticisms really have nothing to do with your current post or even your current mental outlook, then all that's left for me to do is apologize for jumping to conclusions and getting overheated for something that has nothing to do with you. If those criticism are relevant to your posting and current outlook, then perhaps it would make sense for me to continue onward by listing those criticisms that I feel are baseless. If so, I will proceed.

rimantas 14y ago

Disclaimer: I am not a math (or any other) teacher. I am trained as a teacher however. > Khan Academy is doing great stuff, Putting some videos of poor quality (technically and from the teaching point) does not "great stuff" make. It may be helpful to some, though. > and getting great results right now. Care to qualify, what those "great results" are and how the greatness is determined? I repeat myself: I am not a jealous teacher. I am just sad that KA is so overhyped and will have very little impact on education. How many times should it be said: when the problem is not technology, you won't save it with technology. And if someone wants invent effortless learning he then can start looking for philosopher's stone as well.

charlieflowers 14y ago
"Putting some videos of poor quality (technically and from the teaching point) does not "great stuff" make." That's ridiculous. Sure you can find some errors if you look hard. But overall, the videos are excellent. Many, many people have left comments saying how much the videos have helped them learn things they had previously struggled with. You want to label the whole work as "poor quality", which makes it obvious you're not being objective or rational. "Care to qualify, what those 'great results' are and how the greatness is determined?" Real people, who say they previously struggled with a concept or a topic, and now, thanks to these videos, they've had breakthroughs. (I'm sure there are other measurable results we could list as well, but this one is enough to shoot down your claims). "I am just sad that KA is so overhyped and will have very little impact on education." I completely agree that it is overhyped. I'm not sure it will have a huge impact on education ... only time will tell. But it is a fantastic asset that the world did not have until recently, and it has a chance to turn out to be significant. "when the problem is not technology, you won't save it with technology" True. But technology makes new things possible, and allows disruptions to occur. It is often a catalyst.