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If you think scientific discoveries like this are important, _please_ contact your congressperson and indicate that you oppose the catastrophic cuts proposed to

If you think scientific discoveries like this are important, _please_ contact your congressperson and indicate that you oppose the catastrophic cuts proposed to NASA astrophysics in the President's Budget Request: https://www.planetary.org/press-releases/the-planetary-society-reissues-urgent-call-to-reject-disastrous-budget-proposal-for-nasa https://www.planetary.org/press-releases/the-planetary-socie...

ghastmaster 1y ago
There are alternatives to taxation. With enough attention and disposable income, citizens can privately fund amazing things. Like the polio vaccine was. Alternatives: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_non-profit_space_agencies https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_non-profit_space_age...
- jfengel 1y ago
  You mean the polio vaccine distributed by the World Health Organization, and developed with the assistance of the New York Public Health Department?
  - ghastmaster 1y ago
    The Jonas Salk research and development of the first polio vaccine that saved many lives is what I am referring to. See quote and article below. >There was very little government funding for any kind of biomedical research. The polio research was privately funded through the March of Dimes,” explained Randy Juhl, Dean Emeritus and Distinguished Service Professor Emeritus in the School of Pharmacy. https://www.pittwire.pitt.edu/pittwire/features-articles/anniversary-salk-team-s-polio-vaccine-source-hope-covid-19 https://www.pittwire.pitt.edu/pittwire/features-articles/ann...
    - arrosenberg 1y ago
      The same March of Dimes that was founded by Franklin Delano Roosevelt when he was President? Technically the money didn't come from government coffers, but it's very silly (and incorrect) to suggest that the effort was independent of the government.
- comicjk 1y ago
  Regardless of what funding mechanism you would prefer in its place, turning off the existing system with no transition plan is a huge mistake.
gizajob 1y ago
The problem is that this totally unmoves the layman, same as an incremental change in a metaphysical system would unmove the layman. Just one costs a lot more than the other.
- layer8 1y ago
  That's why you want to move the congressman.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > problem is that this totally unmoves the layman Which is why we live in a republic. (And since the Industrial Revolution and Battle of Jena, one twinned to a technocratic administrative state.)
jfengel 1y ago
I appreciate that, and science should be saved. But the cuts go far beyond that, to things that are less showy but with more direct effects on the lives of people. Tens of thousands of jobs have been lost, with microscopic effects on the bottom line, but with myriad small effects on our parks, our roads, even national security. Space is the "charismatic mega fauna" of the budget, but the whole "ecosystem" is ravaged. It must be saved, but take it as an indicator of just how much damage has been done. Spare a thought and a word for the NIH, the Fish and Wildlife Service, and the Social Security administrators whose jobs are not glamorous but nonetheless critical to people who depend on them.
- kulahan 1y ago
  Does astroscience not deserve a spokesperson? We aren’t allowed to be passionate about this if other things are “more important”? Those issues have their cheerleaders, so I see no reason to start with “that’s good, BUT”. I really hate this trend of pretending people are supposed to care about A more than B and that, more than C. Let people champion the things they’re passionate about. Everyone is already suffering from compassion fatigue.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > Spare a thought and a word for the NIH, the Fish and Wildlife Service, and the Social Security administrators Not sure framing this in terms of sympathy for jobless bureaucrats is as effective as considering the impact on babies who will die of diseases in cancelled pipelines, ecosystems and fisheries that will collapse due to negligence or proud grandmas who will go hungry because SSA fucked up their cheques.
devwastaken 1y ago
NASA like all old orgs are extremely inefficient and overwhelmingly waste money. The solution is to create new orgs not hindered by old people that do the least work for the most pay.
- bandyaboot 1y ago
  This has to be satire.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > NASA like all old orgs are extremely inefficient and overwhelmingly waste money The U.S. government just got red teamed by an extremely adversarial auditor in DOGE. They weren’t able to find almost any fraud (outside the DoD, which they didn’t touch). They found maybe tens of billions of spending they didn’t like out of a budget of trillions. Also, we’re on a start-up board. Are you seriously arguing that every start-up, or even the median start-up, is less wasteful than the median century-old company?
  - pfdietz 1y ago
    NASA inefficiency is driven from the top down, by terrible goals and perverse incentives, mainly inflicted on the agency by lawmakers, but also due to getting stuck in a local optimum. It's not bottom up waste and fraud.
    - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
      > NASA inefficiency is driven from the top down, by terrible goals and perverse incentives To the extent there is documented inefficiency at NASA, it's in the way it manages its contractors for manned exploration. Its science budget is a paragon of institutional efficiency. > It's not bottom up waste and fraud Read the GAO report [1]. (Ctrl + F Bechtel.) But for sake of argument, let's assume this is true. How does cutting the science budget while preserving SLS make sense? [1] https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-24-106256 https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-24-106256
physix 1y ago
[flagged]
timewizard 1y ago
NASA did take a 25% budget cut. Through a combination of OMB and NASA decisions this led to a 50% cut in the entire sciences budget which went from $7.3b to $3.9b; however, the line item budgets for both Webb and Hubble are not touched and both are expected to operate at full planned capacity. The rest of the cuts are around propulsion systems and mars science missions. The administration and some parts of NASA see the commercial segment becoming more developed and more capable and are hoping they will be able to fill the gap. This also accelerates the plan to retire the ISS and move to commercial orbital platforms. Interestingly this budget does allocate $646 million more to exploration in 2025 than it did in 2024. Showing a shift in priorities from Earth based science missions to full manned missions returning to the Moon and eventually to Mars.
w10-1 1y ago
If your congressperson is Republican. Only their votes matter for the current budget.

ghastmaster 1y ago

There are alternatives to taxation. With enough attention and disposable income, citizens can privately fund amazing things. Like the polio vaccine was. Alternatives: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_non-profit_space_agencies https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_non-profit_space_age...

jfengel 1y ago
You mean the polio vaccine distributed by the World Health Organization, and developed with the assistance of the New York Public Health Department?
- ghastmaster 1y ago
  The Jonas Salk research and development of the first polio vaccine that saved many lives is what I am referring to. See quote and article below. >There was very little government funding for any kind of biomedical research. The polio research was privately funded through the March of Dimes,” explained Randy Juhl, Dean Emeritus and Distinguished Service Professor Emeritus in the School of Pharmacy. https://www.pittwire.pitt.edu/pittwire/features-articles/anniversary-salk-team-s-polio-vaccine-source-hope-covid-19 https://www.pittwire.pitt.edu/pittwire/features-articles/ann...
  - arrosenberg 1y ago
    The same March of Dimes that was founded by Franklin Delano Roosevelt when he was President? Technically the money didn't come from government coffers, but it's very silly (and incorrect) to suggest that the effort was independent of the government.
comicjk 1y ago
Regardless of what funding mechanism you would prefer in its place, turning off the existing system with no transition plan is a huge mistake.

gizajob 1y ago

The problem is that this totally unmoves the layman, same as an incremental change in a metaphysical system would unmove the layman. Just one costs a lot more than the other.

layer8 1y ago
That's why you want to move the congressman.
JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> problem is that this totally unmoves the layman Which is why we live in a republic. (And since the Industrial Revolution and Battle of Jena, one twinned to a technocratic administrative state.)

jfengel 1y ago

I appreciate that, and science should be saved. But the cuts go far beyond that, to things that are less showy but with more direct effects on the lives of people. Tens of thousands of jobs have been lost, with microscopic effects on the bottom line, but with myriad small effects on our parks, our roads, even national security. Space is the "charismatic mega fauna" of the budget, but the whole "ecosystem" is ravaged. It must be saved, but take it as an indicator of just how much damage has been done. Spare a thought and a word for the NIH, the Fish and Wildlife Service, and the Social Security administrators whose jobs are not glamorous but nonetheless critical to people who depend on them.

kulahan 1y ago
Does astroscience not deserve a spokesperson? We aren’t allowed to be passionate about this if other things are “more important”? Those issues have their cheerleaders, so I see no reason to start with “that’s good, BUT”. I really hate this trend of pretending people are supposed to care about A more than B and that, more than C. Let people champion the things they’re passionate about. Everyone is already suffering from compassion fatigue.
JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> Spare a thought and a word for the NIH, the Fish and Wildlife Service, and the Social Security administrators Not sure framing this in terms of sympathy for jobless bureaucrats is as effective as considering the impact on babies who will die of diseases in cancelled pipelines, ecosystems and fisheries that will collapse due to negligence or proud grandmas who will go hungry because SSA fucked up their cheques.

devwastaken 1y ago

NASA like all old orgs are extremely inefficient and overwhelmingly waste money. The solution is to create new orgs not hindered by old people that do the least work for the most pay.

bandyaboot 1y ago
This has to be satire.
JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> NASA like all old orgs are extremely inefficient and overwhelmingly waste money The U.S. government just got red teamed by an extremely adversarial auditor in DOGE. They weren’t able to find almost any fraud (outside the DoD, which they didn’t touch). They found maybe tens of billions of spending they didn’t like out of a budget of trillions. Also, we’re on a start-up board. Are you seriously arguing that every start-up, or even the median start-up, is less wasteful than the median century-old company?
- pfdietz 1y ago
  NASA inefficiency is driven from the top down, by terrible goals and perverse incentives, mainly inflicted on the agency by lawmakers, but also due to getting stuck in a local optimum. It's not bottom up waste and fraud.
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    > NASA inefficiency is driven from the top down, by terrible goals and perverse incentives To the extent there is documented inefficiency at NASA, it's in the way it manages its contractors for manned exploration. Its science budget is a paragon of institutional efficiency. > It's not bottom up waste and fraud Read the GAO report [1]. (Ctrl + F Bechtel.) But for sake of argument, let's assume this is true. How does cutting the science budget while preserving SLS make sense? [1] https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-24-106256 https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-24-106256

physix 1y ago

[flagged]

timewizard 1y ago

NASA did take a 25% budget cut. Through a combination of OMB and NASA decisions this led to a 50% cut in the entire sciences budget which went from $7.3b to $3.9b; however, the line item budgets for both Webb and Hubble are not touched and both are expected to operate at full planned capacity. The rest of the cuts are around propulsion systems and mars science missions. The administration and some parts of NASA see the commercial segment becoming more developed and more capable and are hoping they will be able to fill the gap. This also accelerates the plan to retire the ISS and move to commercial orbital platforms. Interestingly this budget does allocate $646 million more to exploration in 2025 than it did in 2024. Showing a shift in priorities from Earth based science missions to full manned missions returning to the Moon and eventually to Mars.

w10-1 1y ago

If your congressperson is Republican. Only their votes matter for the current budget.