4 ms·

Tiobe really?

by metaltyphoon 1y ago

Tiobe really?

mahmoudimus 1y ago
I hate on Tiobe as well but it is a good benchmark for world wide adoption commercially.
- dymk 1y ago
  It's basically just the number of Stack Overflow questions / Google hits there are about a language, it's a pretty poor benchmark
- orangeboats 1y ago
  TIOBE is an especially poor benchmark if the programming language community is not highly reliant on general-purpose search engines like Google. Take into consideration that most Rust programmers rely on https://docs.rs https://docs.rs etc rather than Googling something.
dgb23 1y ago
I don't 100% understand. Do they really just look at search engine stats? https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/programminglanguages_definition/ https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/programminglanguages_defin... That seems like it's a potentially interesting signal, but the index implies that it is about adoption. Looking at the index, it seems like Python has a 2.5x higher rating than C and Java. While I assume that Python is a widely adopted language, this feels wrong in many ways. But given that they just look at search engine stats, one can explain the higher rating, because Python is often used by novice programmers and tech workers who are not primarily programmers/SWEs.
garbagecoder 1y ago
OK, so show us your source that shows Rust has higher uptake.
- leadingthenet 1y ago
  https://spectrum.ieee.org/top-programming-languages-2024 https://spectrum.ieee.org/top-programming-languages-2024
  - hu3 1y ago
    Rust jobs: 0.04 Python jobs: 0.9 Seems about right, maybe. Except there's no way PHP (0.09), Ruby (0.07) and Go (0.1) are on the same magnitude as Rust jobs. So this site doesn't pass the sniff test for me.
    - garbagecoder 1y ago
      So it just must be the case that Rust has more jobs because that smells right to you? Even compared to Go which has found a nice niche in networking? If Rust is as good as its evangelists say it is, we won't have to worry about how the stats smell, we'll see it, and it won't rely on some "Cnile" conspiracy to keep it down either.
      - steveklabnik 1y ago
        I think you've got the parent backward: they're saying that Rust "should" have far less jobs than these other technologies. If your parent is wrong, happy to be corrected. I thought it was interesting that we read the post in completely opposite ways, and I think both readings can be accurate. I based my reading on a vague remembering that I think the parent isn't a fan of Rust, which is fuzzy and also may be wrong!

Tiobe really?

mahmoudimus 1y ago

I hate on Tiobe as well but it is a good benchmark for world wide adoption commercially.

dymk 1y ago
It's basically just the number of Stack Overflow questions / Google hits there are about a language, it's a pretty poor benchmark
orangeboats 1y ago
TIOBE is an especially poor benchmark if the programming language community is not highly reliant on general-purpose search engines like Google. Take into consideration that most Rust programmers rely on https://docs.rs https://docs.rs etc rather than Googling something.

dgb23 1y ago

I don't 100% understand. Do they really just look at search engine stats? https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/programminglanguages_definition/ https://www.tiobe.com/tiobe-index/programminglanguages_defin... That seems like it's a potentially interesting signal, but the index implies that it is about adoption. Looking at the index, it seems like Python has a 2.5x higher rating than C and Java. While I assume that Python is a widely adopted language, this feels wrong in many ways. But given that they just look at search engine stats, one can explain the higher rating, because Python is often used by novice programmers and tech workers who are not primarily programmers/SWEs.

garbagecoder 1y ago

OK, so show us your source that shows Rust has higher uptake.

leadingthenet 1y ago
https://spectrum.ieee.org/top-programming-languages-2024 https://spectrum.ieee.org/top-programming-languages-2024
- hu3 1y ago
  Rust jobs: 0.04 Python jobs: 0.9 Seems about right, maybe. Except there's no way PHP (0.09), Ruby (0.07) and Go (0.1) are on the same magnitude as Rust jobs. So this site doesn't pass the sniff test for me.
  - garbagecoder 1y ago
    So it just must be the case that Rust has more jobs because that smells right to you? Even compared to Go which has found a nice niche in networking? If Rust is as good as its evangelists say it is, we won't have to worry about how the stats smell, we'll see it, and it won't rely on some "Cnile" conspiracy to keep it down either.
    - steveklabnik 1y ago
      I think you've got the parent backward: they're saying that Rust "should" have far less jobs than these other technologies. If your parent is wrong, happy to be corrected. I thought it was interesting that we read the post in completely opposite ways, and I think both readings can be accurate. I based my reading on a vague remembering that I think the parent isn't a fan of Rust, which is fuzzy and also may be wrong!